John Calipari: Recruiting Without Prejudice
"My genuine opinion of the Kentucky basketball program is that there is only one and it is top drawer, Park Avenue, and that all other basketball programs in the country think they are, but they are not. At Kentucky, basketball is a type of religion, such a fanatical obsession that they expect to be national champions each year, and they live and die with each ball game."
"I'm not looking to throw a party for Kentucky, but that is how I feel. I think it's an honest appraisal because I've seen all the programs, touching them as a coach, a player and as an NBC broadcast commentator ... I have touched all the so-called capitals of basketball, but when it gets down to the short stroke, the only true capital of basketball is in Lexington."
Word on the street is; Kentucky basketball fans just want a winner. They don't want double-digit loss seasons, they don't want anything approaching mediocrity in anything the boys in blue do, either on or off the court. They demand to be entertained, and the best way for a Kentucky basketball fan to be entertained is to witness their beloved Cats throttle those who dare challenge Big Blue. It is those types of demands by the fan base who support the Cats with either their dollars through the purchase of apparel, tickets, or donations to the athletic department that are the reason Kentucky basketball stands perched above those who think college basketball is merely a game that young men play. To Kentucky fans, Wildcat basketball isn't a game, it's a lifestyle, it's a birthright, it's a quasi-religion, loudly and proudly passed down from grandparent, to parent, to offspring.
Simply put, pity the fool who fails to realize the righteous truth of Kentucky basketball as being all-important to the Commonwealth. One man, though, whose eyes are open to the realization that UK basketball fans are a serious lot, is John Calipari.
Upon Calipari's hiring last spring, the Big Blue Nation, almost as if on cue, cheered and rejoiced at the marriage of the hottest coach in the land with the most prodigious program in the land. Thoughts of Final Fours and national championships danced through the heads of all those whose allegiance is sworn to the Cats of Kentucky. After four years of mind-numbing mediocrity, Kentucky fans pontificated it would take Calipari and his recruiting genius only a snippet of time to bring Camelot back to its former glory and prestige.
But, at what cost?
Winning, rather, winning at the highest level in the new age of college basketball comes with a certain amount of measured risk. Due to the collective bargaining agreement between the NBA and the NBA Player's Association, struck in 2004 and first instituted in the 2005 NBA Draft, states that in order for a player to be eligible to play in the Association the player must be at least one year out of high school, and at least 19-years-old.
For various reasons, the Kentucky basketball program has not had to deal with the well-meaning but flawed NBA age limit rule until now -- Former Kentucky head coach Tubby Smith famously refused to deal with street agents, runners, or AAU coaches during his 10 years at the helm of the Kentucky basketball program, which curtailed his ability to successfully recruit the top flight talent to Lexington; Rick Pitino didn't have to deal with these issues because there was no "one-and-done" rule during his tenure with the Cats; and Billy Gillispie didn't have to deal with these issues because he consistently swung and missed on his blue chip (Patrick Patterson and Daniel Orton were not thought to be one-and-done propsects out of high school), NBA-or-bust recruiting prospects. John Calipari has no such problems, but he does have other issues to deal with. Issues, that, for the first time, UK fans are being forced to confront.
Because of the Kentucky head coach's God-given charisma, his player-friendly dribble-drive offense, and the coupling of Calipari with Kentucky, the man in charge has drawn the interest of most of the NBA-level high school talent. Not only within the boundaries of the United States, but around the basketball playing world. And elite talent comes with, at times, question marks. Question marks about academic integrity, question marks about narcissistic agents, question marks about unscrupulous AAU coaches, and question marks about whether a foreign recruit drew a salary while playing overseas. Instead of the best players in the country (and around the world) declaring for the NBA Draft directly out of high school, now, a college coach interested in luring said talent to his campus are forced to navigate the shark-infested waters of elite prospect recruiting, as well as NCAA eligibility issues that are part and parcel in modern-day top-tier talent recruitment.
Calipari, instead of refusing to recruit those with possible eligibility issues, has taken a tack tilted toward getting the best players possible, while leaving eligibility issues for UK's compliance department (ably headed by Sandy Bell), and the NCAA Eligibility Center to figure out. And although the NCAA burned Calipari (indirectly) and Memphis (directly) over the Derrick Rose ACT issue, Calipari has rightly opted to press forward in his quest for the next great player for the fanatics occupying Rupp Arena to cheer on.
And, really, would Kentucky basketball fans have it any other way? No rule breaking, no backroom deals, rather, a winner within the parameters of NCAA statutes, that is in essence, what UK bluebloods want. And that is just what Calipari is giving the masses in the Bluegrass with his recruiting posture.
Kentucky didn't become the standard-bearer of excellence in the world of college basketball by recruiting mediocre talent. Kentucky became the 20th century's "Roman Empire" of college hoops by chasing, catching, and developing the best amateur basketball players in the world. To toss that tried and true (blue) philosophy aside because of the headaches inherent in bringing the best talent to Lexington would be foolhardy, and a sure recipe for the descent of UK basketball into the realm of the once-greats. Which is not the legacy handed down over the past 70 years from grandparents, to parents, to offspring. And a circumstance best left to nightmares, rather than reality.
Darnel Dodson News
Marc Maggard, over at True Blue Kentucky, is reporting that Darnel Dodson is no longer on the Kentucky basketball team ... in any shape or form.
Thanks for reading, and Go Cats!
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Comments
Al could turn on the charm when the occasion
called for it. And he could give Billy Packer grief all day long. Personally I think Cal is doing this to keep me active all year long. No rest for the weary. Lol.
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 8, 2010 10:24 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Met Al one time while on a trip
to Milwaukee. I was waiting at the airport to catch my flight home and spotted him talking on the phone. When he finished his call, I introduced myself as a wildcat fan. He looked at me for a second and said, “Northwestern, Villanova, Arizona…?” I said UK and he laughed and said he should have known.
I woke up feeling BLUE this morning. It's gonna be a great day.
That old clip of Al dancing around at the NCAA Tournament-
Is priceless. And I also remember Coach Cal sayin when first hired “I recruit the best of the best” UK fans wouldn’t want it any other way…
"You are what you are and you ain't what you ain't"
That explains it
Reading that statement explains to me why you guys really don’t mind having a cheater who risks vacating your seasons as the coach. You risked having Calipari have a 3rd season vacated with the Kanter situation.
You may win a championship on the court with professional players and will celebrate and gloat. But, when this all blows up on you, UK is put on probation, while Calipari jumps to the NBA in a year or two, you will have gotten what you wanted.
Said the fan of the team that lost two top recruits to UK
Then it comes to be that the soothing light at the end of your tunnel, is just a freight train coming your way...
@btcoop71
Did someone say championship?
So, does your crystal ball say when we may win that championship? Just askin’. :-)
Blue... there is no other color to Bleed !!!
And I bet
you believe that if you are good for the rest of the year, you will get all of your wishes for Christmas.
I woke up feeling BLUE this morning. It's gonna be a great day.
We don't usually do this here,
but you are a great example of a raving lunatic who needs to go back to school and take reading comprehension. Because if you in any way take away from my piece that we (UK fans) don’t care if our coach cheats … hell, I even wrote the exact opposite in the article.
Good luck with life, you’re gonna need it.
Your state
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 8, 2010 11:53 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Statement might carry more weight if it
was in any way factually accurate. However since Calipari has not yet allowed him to play your argument is moot. And learn your history son. We are the Capitol of the world of college basketball. Get over it.
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 8, 2010 11:57 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
If you want to comment on here ...
… you will stop the baiting. Please read our community guidelines and observe them.
This is your one warning.
A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan
When will you people get it straight?!
There are NO violations at play here. He will either be declared an amatuer and play, or declared a pro and not play. Simple as that. UK is in no danger here. No recruiting violations or payments to worry about.
Wait a minute,
wasn’t your school poised to go to the dance with Enes? Risky for us but not for you? I hope you got your shots because you sound like a rabid Husky to me.
I woke up feeling BLUE this morning. It's gonna be a great day.
I am feeling mischievous
So let me say this as the devil’s advocate……Ken that is a dangerous approach to have. There may be a reason Tubby didn’t recruit the best talent and put together All Americans day in and day out and that was because of the danger. He won a title and had an excellent record to boot. Yet Calipari has no title but two final fours vacated because of his reckless approach to recruiting. Kentucky and Calipari……very dangerous marriage. His need to please his bride may unwittingly do her harm.
Now bring on the comments :)
I respect your opinion, and
certainly reasonable people may disagree, but I have to ask you one question regarding one of your sentences: You seem to blame Calipari’s “reckless approach to recruting” for the two vacated FF’s. In what way was Cal’s recruiting to blame?
Ken
I will agree that the word reckless is a bit strong.
And I would not blame Cal BUT i would point out that when you recruit high profile players, the players typically have an entourage that is looking out for their (the entourage’s) best interest NOT the player and certainly NOT the college. As a result, agents (read: Camby) and questionable test scores/sites (read: Rose) will certainly be a possibility as the entourage looks to protect “their” future/investment.
Combined with a rabid fan base and you have a POTENTIALLY combustible issue.
Reckless? no Riskier? yes Calculated Risk? yes and worth it
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 9, 2010 9:55 AM EDT up reply actions
as if on cue..
http://www.gazettenet.com/2010/09/09/calipari-camby-lessons-learned
Calipari quote
“We had done everything prior. We put together a group of people to interview the agents before they could talk to our players,” he said. “I was stunned. Here was a kid who lived in the dorm the whole time, never had a car, wore sweat suits the whole time and never had clothes that way. His mother lived in the same house in the projects in Hartford that she lived in the entire time he was in school. They never asked for one thing. He knew he made a mistake and he paid for it. But this was not our program issue or our university issue. This is an agent issue. This kid was preyed upon.”
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 9, 2010 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions
Ok
remember I am playing devils advocate here. I am not sure how I feel other then, if we end u p getting in trouble because of some recruit, I am going to be ticked. Reckless is a very relative term! If I don’t wear a seat belt….am I reckless? Some might say yes and some might say no. If you are recruiting with a no holds bar approach you better be ready for the consquences! Is it his fault that Camby cheated or that Rose possibly cheated….no. But because of those two players, two programs received some dire consquences. He recruits with no safety belt. As does the best of the best.
LOL!
I don’t think not wearing a seat belt can be interpreted by anyone with common sense as anything but reckless, dangerous, etc. This issue, though, is certainly open to interpretation, but it really comes down to one thing: Do fans want Cal to continue to recruit the way he has done thus far? Or do they want him to alter his style in an effort to be “safer?”
Obviously, I am in the “keep doing what you’re doing” camp, but I do understand those who wish he would be “safer” when it comes to recruiting.
In order to be sucessful in today’s college basketball world, risks have to be taken, and they are taken by almost everyone who matters. Look who else recruited Bledsoe, Wall, Kanter, Selby: Kansas, Florida, Duke, Tennessee to just name a few. Refusing to recruit kids with possible “issues” removes many of the top flight recruits from the recruiting radar.
That tis true!
I totally agree so you see why fans like me are somewhat confused on our feelings! We love the recruits that are coming in but still hiding our eyes and hoping that everything turns out ok :). With Tubby I felt safe. Didn’t like the lack of final fours but I felt safe. With Cal I don’t know htat I will ever feel that way. But I do love the feeling of having the best of the best playing for Kentucky and competing for a title year in and year out! Kinda of like driving a race car. . Such an awesome feeling, yet you know that there is an inherient danger of dying of getting hurt. But that exhilaration feels so good you tend to forget about the risk until the unthinkable happens.
Hey, I sometimes
hide my eyes, also.
Your paragraph probably fairly accurately describes how many UK fans feel.
Better to have won and vacated,
than to have never won at all. We were safe under Tubby and I relish remembering those moments of safety every day! Yeah, right.
I woke up feeling BLUE this morning. It's gonna be a great day.
I can't help it.
No one wore seat belts 30 years ago. We had the same information then and drove large steel cars with pointy dashboards perfect for 8 yr old ka bob.
Negligence yes. Reckless no.
But this doesn’t help with recruiting troubles. Unless the recruit is driving a new SUV and Tipton is around to write about it and he isn’t wearing a seat belt.
1998-2007 And 1990-97 Recruiting
98 to 07 produced 13 HS A-A and 2 JuCo A-A. During those 10 years, UK had 3 college A-A.
90 to 97 produced 12 HS A-A and 2 JuCo A-A. During those 8 years, UK had 2 college A-A.
But the latter timeframe produced 27 W per season.
The former only produced 26 W per season.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 6:45 AM EDT up reply actions
1998-2007 And 1990-97 Final Fours
2 in 8 years = 25% of the time in the former time period
1 in 10 years = 10% of the time in the latter time period
Pitino recruited with probation as his base. Smith recruited with 3 straight trips to the final game as his base.
Smith did a better job recruiting than he gets credit for and I believe he was the most ethical coach in UK history.
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 9, 2010 10:01 AM EDT up reply actions
Actually 3 And 1
But NC were 1 each.
SEC titles were 2 in 8 years, or 5 in 10.
SECT championships were 5 in 8 years or 5 in 10.
My point was the Pitino didn’t recruit better than Hall, Sutton, or Tubby. He just achieved more with lesser talent in some cases.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 11:36 AM EDT up reply actions
which is what i was thinking...
but i always wanted to believe tubby was a better coach than pitino
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 9, 2010 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions
NOW He Is (Won 5 Of 7 Versus Pitino Since 2001)
But not in the 1990’s. Only Coach K and Dean Smith were comparable to P in the 90’s.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Tubby
was just more likable then Pitino. I think Calipari is more of a good mixture of the two. Killer intincts yet very likable!******
Disclaimer**** If things get rough yall, you need to prepare yourself for an ugly cal. Memphis has seen it and so have I. LHL, and others will not like that side of him. I guarentee it.
Depends Whom You Ask
Some players didn’t like T.
Some didn’t like P either.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe once upon a time, but....
I don’t doubt that Cal had to work the limits of propriety at UMass and Memphis in order to recruit high-quality talent. There is also no doubt that as a diehard UK fan I am biased, but I really can’t see why Cal would have to cheat at this point. He’s the coach at one of the all-time great programs, virtually every game is on national TV, our style of play is like candy to any top prospect, he’s filing up the NBA with his ex-players and he doesn’t seem to be a jerk like some coaches we may have had recently. That ought to be enough to entice any elite prospect. I suspect that the vast majority of these athletes are willing to play by the rules for a year or two in order to get to the promised land. I just can’t see any incentive for him to break the rules at this point.
He Rarely Signed Big Talent At UMass
Marcus Camby was HS A-A but most of his players were lower rated guys that developed.
Memphis, he signed some very good talent there.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 7:21 AM EDT up reply actions
But As You Point Out...
even in memphis he did not sign many big men. Dorsey was the closest and he was more of a 4 playing the 5, imo….
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 9, 2010 10:03 AM EDT up reply actions
by Big he didnt mean size
he meant rating
"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."
I agree with Ken
recruiting had nothing to do with it. In the Camby case, the NCAA even went so far as to say Cal was a victum of Camby’s rogue behavior!
So getting the top classes is reckless?
Was it reckless when Pitino brought in guys like Tony Delk, Ron Mercer, Antoine Walker etc?
Then it comes to be that the soothing light at the end of your tunnel, is just a freight train coming your way...
@btcoop71
Was it reckless when Tubby brought in
Keith Bogans, Rajon Rondo, Randolph Morris, Joe Crawford ?
Then it comes to be that the soothing light at the end of your tunnel, is just a freight train coming your way...
@btcoop71
No in either case...
Cal seems to have taken it to another level. still not reckless, but as i posted above i do believe it involves more risk when you focus on high profile players.
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 9, 2010 10:05 AM EDT up reply actions
I follow
Is there more risk for Nick Saban and Urban Meyer, since they recruit the best in football?
Sure.
Are they going to suddenly stop trying to get the best of the best because a player may not be elligible?
Hell no.
And they are not reckless for it.
Then it comes to be that the soothing light at the end of your tunnel, is just a freight train coming your way...
@btcoop71
Polarizing
Let’s face it. With Cal, you either love him or you hate his guts. For all the haters, they’re just looking for another reason to confirm their opinions. I’ll admit that I was never very objective with Billy Packer and I still see red when I think of Roy Williams.
by chicagoblues on Sep 9, 2010 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions
None Of Those (Except Bogans Maybe) Was At The Level Of Calipari Recruits
All HS A-A to be sure.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions
Pitino Rarely Signed The #1 Class
Only in 1992.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions
Tenken....
You need to do some research about “10 Loss Tubby”, Yes, he does have a National Championship, won with players who were recruited & trained by Rick Pitino. After that season his record was OK but not what was expected of him. Not made public, but when he was asked to make changes in his staff, he also asked for things that could not and would not be given to him. As of that he went looking for another job, in Feb. of the year before he left, he made a deal with UM behind the back of UK and made one last request of UK which they declined and he quit. As of now look at the mess he has gotten into at Mn. Players leaving, gone to court because he lied to a coach and it has cost the school a nice sum of money. I’m just glad he is gone from KY and now the true Smith has come out and it isn’t at UK
Couple of things
The players on the ‘98 team, at least the ones I’ve interviewed (Shep and Mills), give full credit to Smith for the title. Even Rick Pitino said he would not have won the title with that team.
As far as staff changes, I don’t know what you think you know, but Smith was asked to get rid of a couple of people, he refused. But, the staff change “controversy” isn’t why he left.
As far as Minn. is concerned, he took over a program that was absolutely floundering, in terrible shape, and had been since Haskins resigned. The job he’s done there is semi-remarkable considering the shape of the program when he took over.
Smith, while certainly not without his shortcomings during his time at UK, was a great ambassador for the University and state. There are very few men who possess his integrity and system of values, especially in the major college coaching professionl.
I TOTALLY agree with you.
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
with Ken
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
agree with you both
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 9, 2010 10:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Well Stated And FAIR
He was never perfect but met or exceed MOST UK basketball standards.
He fell short on FF (he made 1, UK averages 2 per decade) and E8 (he made 4, UK averages 5 per decade).
He’s done OK at Minnesota, not great even by Gopher standards.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 8:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Can we say you have a dislike for Tubby?
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
Me, No
Just be FAIR and objective. Say whatever you want.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 8:55 PM EDT up reply actions
I think Tubby did a good job. Period
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
Some Do
Many don’t.
So long as either stays F And O (see above), no problem here.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 8:59 PM EDT up reply actions
paris - where have you been....
i do not mean to bait you, but Forty has been one of Tubby’s strongest supporters – not saying that is good or bad, but it is clear he has no dislike for him.
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 9, 2010 10:39 PM EDT up reply actions
People may disagree
I concede Tubby was a “good ambassador.” However, that is not the same as the sort of basketball coach for UK that fans expect. I remember Tubby bringing his UGA teams into Rupp and looking like a deer in the headlights against Rick’s teams. He had no idea how to respond to our teams. I opposed Tubby as UK’s coach in 1997; I maintained that opposition throughout his UK career. My opposition centered on the fact that Tubby was a good coach, but never had the ability to be a great one. Both Tubby and I were in complete shock at the end of the 1998 season. Neither of us recovered.
People may disagree......
jdogblue…………“I remember Tubby bringing UGA teams into Rupp and looking like a deer in the headlights………” True. In Rupp.
In 1996 Rick took the best BB team in the world and in the history of the game, to Georgia and needed some last minute heroics from Allen Edwards to pull that one out of the fire. Thought mabye you didn’t remember.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Overlooked It But Remembered OF COURSE
But’s that’s favorable to Tubby so it wasn’t mentioned.
Tubby wasn’t perfect. He had flaws. But he was a darn good UK basketball coach until he end.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 11:55 AM EDT up reply actions
I think Smith was the best
x’s and o’s coach UK has had since Rupp. That’s not a slight on Hall, Sutton or Pitino, either, I just think Smith is that good on the sidelines.
by Ken Howlett on Sep 10, 2010 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions
UK Basketball (All-Time)
UK wins 76% of its games. Tubby won 76% of his UK games.
UK wins 69% of its NCAA games. Tubby won 72% of his NCAA games at UK.
UK averages 1 NC per 10 years. Tubby won 1 NC in 10 years.
UK averages 2 FF per 10 years. Tubby only made 1 FF.
UK averages 5 E8 per 10 years. Tubby only made 4 E8 in 10 years.
UK averages 6 S16 per 10 years. Tubby made 6 S16 in 10 years.
UK averages 5 SEC titles per 10 years. Tubby won 5 SEC titles in 10 years.
UK averages 5 SECT championships per 10 years. Tubby won 5 SECT in 10 years.
Only 2 UK coaches have defeated North Carolina, Duke, Indiana, UCLA, and Kansas. One was Adolph Rupp. The other one is Tubby.
There are TONS more stats and tidbits like these. I doubt any are the REAL reason for your opposition.
At least you’re honest about it.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions
How Is It Then That Tubby Has Won 5 Of 7 Versus Pitino In 2000's?
Hmm. That doesn’t fit with your description.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions
Certainly
I gave you FACTS supporting my opinion(s).
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 8:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Well Stated And Fair
“exceed”=exceeded. Go back to school.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Can everyone stop it, PLEASE?!?!
Community guideline #4 clearly states (and I pasted)
Don’t be a Grammar Nazi in the comments. Comments are not editable, and if someone makes an error, don’t point it out in a nasty way or use it as evidence of mental or cognitive deficiency in a rebuttal. Let it go.- [emphasis MINE!]
Blue... there is no other color to Bleed !!!
We need a Scandal
you, know, to keep us busy.
Maybe somebody’s got a picture of Cal with a hostess: and a cell phone?
:)
No matter where you're at, there you are
UGA is down to SCar
They have on those pink pants!! ’-)
Blue... there is no other color to Bleed !!!
First Part Is BALONEY
5 players on the 1998 team never played for Pitino. Few started for him. None averaged 10+ ppg or made ALL-SEC for him. All excelled from 1998 on.
The “not made publci” part is also BS. Both Saul and GG coached at UK already.
He did NOT “go looking for another job” in Feb 2007. Utterly false.
Pure 100% unadulterated hogwash!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 8:52 PM EDT up reply actions
If They're FAIR And Objective Like You Are
I have no complaints. But the BS espoused by that Dynasty Defender above is another story.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 8:54 PM EDT up reply actions
What’s wrong with defending a dynasty? So now I guess the likes of Casey Stengel are fit only for file 13?
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Nothing Whatsoever
But Dynasty Defenders (group) is VERY different than defending a dynasty. Better name for their group would be Perpetuating A Stereotype.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions
wow! guess someone was wrong
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
He may or may not have gone "looking" but he communicated with Minn through an intermediary.
It is published. I won’t have this fight again, but I hold you to fair and objective too 40. The Minn AD admitted to communicating with Tubby through a friend and confirming Tubby’s desire for the job in Feb during the season.
Not In February 2007
His agent took exploratory calls to gauge interest in late 2006. No one was looking for anything until March 2007.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions
McGuire
Loved UK under Joe Hall but not under Rupp.
He was very critical of the Cats in the 60’s particularly.
No idea why.
No black players.
I woke up feeling BLUE this morning. It's gonna be a great day.
I Doubt That
McGuiire signed mostly white players. He rarely signed more than 1 black recruit per year.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions
This articles says different
http://www3.jsonline.com/sports/marq/jan01/howacol30012901.asp
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
nice pickup there Paris....interesting read......
and written by an African American to boot…..
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions
thanks
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
Thanks Paris.
I woke up feeling BLUE this morning. It's gonna be a great day.
Except
Those players stretched over 15 to 20 year timeframe.
McGuire had a simple recruiting strategy. Sign 1 star recruit per year. Typically urban, usually black. The rest of his recruits were typically white.
I saw Marquette play Xavier frequently in the 60’s. I remember their rosters.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Marquette Rosters (From Boxscores)
http://www.bigbluehistory.net/bb/Statistics/Marquette.html McGuire teams played UK several times. Click on the boxscores. From memory (of the names), about 4 or 5 Marquette players were black, the rest white.
He owned Eastern recruiting back then.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions
A couple of hours ago, I googled this
Found a site with a lot of Marquette basketball info, including several team pics from 1966-70, and 40 is right, 3 or 4 black players out of 12-16 total on team. They were ahead of us on integrating their team, led by McGuire, who said he never recruited a kid “who had grass growing in front of his house.”
Very Similar At UC
1, 2 tops, black recruits per year. 3 or 4 on the rosters during 1960’s.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Forty
Because Al and Adolph had personalities like the two opposite poles of magnets. They repelled each other.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Proof
The link beloo is Exhibit A why Enes Kanter should not play in a Kentucky uniform. The NCAA rules are clear: Pros are not allowed. Enes Kanter played as a role. Even if he got a free wrist-band, his eligibility should be disallowed. We’re Kentucky, and we don’t need to bend or break the rules to win.
See Kanter in locker room photo of Fenerbahce Ulker pro team after victory where he scored a key layup and free-throw. http://www.fenerbahce.org/eng/detay.asp?ContentID=2084
we don’t need to bend or break the rules to win.
Did you just wake up from a long nap? This is precisely what the NCAA is looking in to. If they decide he is eligible, he did not break any rules. If they find minor violations, they will punish him with missed games.
I woke up feeling BLUE this morning. It's gonna be a great day.
"long nap"
lol
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 9, 2010 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions
Joined and make only one comment? Not on a fishing expedition are we?
You go to Turkey, play as a 14 yr old, and then come back and talk about what should be and what should not. The NCAA changed the rule, not Kentucky. They realized as most rational individuals do, that the structure of play over there is such that if a young man like enes has a God-given ability and wants to use that ability to further his life, then he has to use their system.
The rules of their system are such that Enes could not be a professional until he turned 18 years of age. He had to be an adult in order to come under contract. Again, their rules, not Kentucky’s. If the young man is ruled ineligible, then fine, no harm no foul, and all of you detractors can sit back on your hoisted petards and claim victory, and pat yourselves on the back for saving the integrity of NCAA basketball. But until the NCAA says, “I am sorry young man, you do not qualify to play” then your sentiments, while possibly being rooted in the sincerest of intentions, serve no purpose other than to enflame the members of this hallowed fraternity.
And by the way, according to the NCAA rule, wrist bands are allowed.
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 8:02 AM EDT up reply actions
Who knew Washington fans cares so much?
Then it comes to be that the soothing light at the end of your tunnel, is just a freight train coming your way...
@btcoop71
Fenerbahce Ulker
It’s one thing for a European player to join the club system as a teenager. It’s another to play on the roster of the most elite pro basketball team in Turkey. It’s the equivalent of an American college soccer team signing a player from Chelsea or AC Madrid. A pro is a pro is a pro. We don’t need an NCAA ruling to figure out this deal is bad. We are each capable of coming to our own rational conclusions. Kanter looks like a great kid, but he’s a pro. I wish him well in the NBA.
by Stephen Trimble on Sep 9, 2010 8:29 AM EDT up reply actions
Hey, if I am the most elite pro basketball team in the country and I can get a top notch amateur
talent and not have to pay for him, I make it happen. As I said before, the NCAA rules were changed for just such an occasion because they saw the iniquity in the standard that previously existed. If they want to change the rules, we have to play by those rules. A 14-17 yr old kid is not, I repeat NOT a pro either here or in Turkey. Those are the rules. He cannot be a pro there until he is 18, he cannot be a pro here until he is 19……them’s the rules.
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 8:36 AM EDT up reply actions
Professional
If you think Enes Kanter was an unpaid amateur on the biggest pro team in Turkey, well, we really have nothing to discuss. We just disagree on the basic facts.
I don’t begrudge Calipari for working every angle to his advantage, but there are limits. And the recruitment of Enes Kanter is too obviously beyond the line of fair play.
by Stephen Trimble on Sep 9, 2010 8:54 AM EDT up reply actions
ALL European kids play for these pro clubs and their farm system teams.
That is why the NCAA changed the rule. They are run similarly to our AAU programs. Maybe the problem is AAU too, but the NCAA is just trying to level the playing field. This isn’t obviously a problem at all. All it means is that an underaged kid in the feeder teams was good enough to play for the top team.
EEU
Europe has a functional equivalent of the AAU, it’s true, but Fenerbache Ulker is not in that category. As I wrote before, it’s the equivalent of soccer’s (football’s) Chelsea in the English Premier League. Playing for this team was not Enes Kanter’s only option, but, unfortunately for us, that’s the one he took.
by Stephen Trimble on Sep 9, 2010 9:18 AM EDT up reply actions
if he was a paid pro
then Fenerbache Ulker broke the law. they are not allowed to sign contracts with kids under 18.
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 9, 2010 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions
Huh?
What law? You know Turkish employment law?
by Stephen Trimble on Sep 9, 2010 10:28 AM EDT up reply actions
He's correct, it has been reported elsewhere
I’ll find you a link
Then it comes to be that the soothing light at the end of your tunnel, is just a freight train coming your way...
@btcoop71
Perhaps
I admit I don’t know the details, but you don’t need the kind of contract we’re talking about here to be paid as a professional.
by Stephen Trimble on Sep 9, 2010 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions
Basically you can't sign a FIBA contract until you are 18
If this club was circumventing FIBA rules to pay him, then they will suffer the consequences for it from FIBA.
Then it comes to be that the soothing light at the end of your tunnel, is just a freight train coming your way...
@btcoop71
really?
then why didn’t Wall go straight to the NBA?
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 9, 2010 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Not Permitted By NBA Draft Rules
He didn’t meet age requirement, I think.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 2:16 PM EDT up reply actions
I think what he was getting at
was why didn’t Wall just play for a team without a contract and just play and get paid on the side? I know it is a silly question but that is exactly why Memphis asked it.
"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."
Exactly...
If NBA has restrictions on who a pro team can sign, why can’t a FIBA team?
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 9, 2010 3:04 PM EDT up reply actions
i referred to the age restriction below
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 9, 2010 3:05 PM EDT up reply actions
I do now,thanks to a few well placed articles you are free to look up yourself.
The league in which Kanter played is prohibited from putting any minor under contract or paying them for playing games. If this “salary” is proved to be true, then they will have to pay fines according to how much they paid to him. That is how much money that kid represents to that team. They are willing to pay fines to get him back so they get compensated for his leaving.
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions
nba prohibits signing players until a certain age...
why sound so shocked that FIBA would have such limitations?
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 9, 2010 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions
only FIBA found a way around the "one and done scenario"....lol
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Truth
If it was proven he was paid a salary, then he can’t play at UK simple as that. But, he didn’t sign a contract, and if he can prove the money he was given was for expenses and not salary then he’ll play.
Then it comes to be that the soothing light at the end of your tunnel, is just a freight train coming your way...
@btcoop71
Greg
If you meant inequity instead of iniquity, it’s ok. Both are quite correct.LOL
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Playing for a pro team is not the definition of a pro.
Amatures used to play in the same tournaments of pros in gold and tennis all the time. Still do perhaps, though now if they are good enough, they take the money.
Jack
For many who play the game, “golf” is “gold.” Hee. Hee. LOL
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
These situations are known as "opens." There's one going on right now
in New York, the U.S. Tennis Open. Amateurs are permitted to play against pros without forfeiting their amateur standing. They can receive certain benefits as well. The situation with Kanter was well-known before he came to the U.S. He played with a pro team for a few games and the question is did he receive a salary for doing so (impermissible) or recovery of permitted expenses?
Simple as that.
McGuire is my protype for a commentator
He was quiet and thoughtful. I was a kid during his broadcasts and listening to him was like going to basketball school. I remember, vividly, him talking about getting a lead down to single digits. He called it a psychological barrier. He understood the combination of x’s, o’s, and psychology. 30 years later, that holds true. He was a coach and you knew it.
There are very few of his kind left. It’s all hype, “diaper dandy’s”, etc. Very little real analysis. Sorry to say the guys who comes closest to McGuire, now, are Bobbie Knight and Brent Musburger.
Shoot me, I have an IQ over 100.
No matter where you're at, there you are
Like you, I loved Al McGuire
But I never really thought of him as quiet. Thoughtful, yes, but full of enthusiasm for the game and the players.
Hell of a coach, too.
Quiet? I guess you're right -- he got emotional
and that was great… I think I was comparing him to the nuts that announce today’s games, without realizing it. Listen to those guys. One team is up and they’re all hyped with that team. The other team get’s the mo’ and their five are all first round draft picks.
I’ve been thinking about this since my post.
Am I just getting too old? I told some kids to get off my lawn last night. Turned the darned sprinklers on them… (j/k — relax all who are humor impaired)
No, there is still a place for genuine analysis.
I miss Al.
No matter where you're at, there you are
Cincy
You’re right and the reason is that these guys don’t know a thing about BB, announcing,
or coaching. They’re just ad-libing. No real knowledge.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
McGuire is my prototype.....
I couldn’t stand Al McGuire until I met him at the Holiday Inn East at the Fairgrounds one Sun.
around 9:30 AM. There was a stamp show there that day. Marquette was playing Louisville later and Al said he had some time to kill and did I know of anything of interest he could do.
I told him about the stamp show, and he became very excited because he was a philatelist too. I walked with him to the showroom and he thanked me and began to browse. After he left,
one of the dealers ask me if I knew who that man was that had bought some of his stamps.
I replyed yes, that was Al McGuire. And the dealer said we were the only two who knew who Al was. Unbelieveable!
As I left the show Al was sitting in a chair by the window reading the Lou. rag. I ask him if he would mind autographing a blank envelope I happened to have. He was more than gracious enough to do so. One of my prized possessions! How things can change when one realizes that the person he scorned is not a monster at all.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Great.......
And thank you for appreciating it. I apologize for being tardy in my response to your reply.
But I have so much fan mail it’s hard to keep up. “And the crowd roared with laughter.”
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Al could act crazy
but was always classy.
I woke up feeling BLUE this morning. It's gonna be a great day.
Al could.....
That’s true, kywineman. He was.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
I do miss Al McGuire
I wasn’t around when he coached, but I do study the history of college ball. I remember him as a braodcaster and loved it when he called a game on TV.
just asking
has there ever been a coach at UK in any sport that had to be defended as much as Cal? I don’t remember one.
When do we find about Bledsoe?
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
...I can think of one... ;)
It is not worth an intelligent man’s time to be in the majority. By definition, there are already enough people to do that.
by kentuckygirl0724 on Sep 9, 2010 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions
actually, Gillispie, and Tubby both
Both were equally voraciously defended and criticized by fans and media alike.
by blue kentucky girl on Sep 9, 2010 8:31 PM EDT up reply actions
I guess that pretty much sums it up, all of them.
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
I just think
the Kentucky head basketball coach position, by its very essence, invites a great deal of defending :)
by blue kentucky girl on Sep 9, 2010 8:46 PM EDT up reply actions
The head bb coach at UK, whomever he is,
is the most scrutinized man in the United States, at least from Nov. to Apr.
Even Tubby?
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
But Blue, one only has to defend one’s self if they have been arraigned and charged with some misdeed. In a court of law, the accused needs a defense attorney, not the plaintiff. I’m not a lawyer but watched an awful lot of “Law and Order.” LOL
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Not Just Those 2
Rupp, Hall, and Sutton also.
Yes, Rupp got more “hate mail” than any other UK coach.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 10:22 PM EDT up reply actions
He And Rupp Had The Same Admin Asst
She said Rupp got the most hate mail.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 10:32 PM EDT up reply actions
none of them deserved it
It comes with the job sadly. If you can’t handle that, don’t take the job. Go somewhere cold where no one cares if don’t win more than 22 games.
His name was Adolph Rupp.....you might remember the guy......
was the most hated coach in all of college basketball for decades. Seems as though his peers in the world of coaching thought he was a “cheater”. You see he used players he wasn’t supposed to. He didn’t use players he should. Sound familiar?? His players got paid for playing…..things like that. It was all his fault.
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions
Whats with the name change ABC?
It is not worth an intelligent man’s time to be in the majority. By definition, there are already enough people to do that.
by kentuckygirl0724 on Sep 9, 2010 10:59 AM EDT up reply actions
He wants to be known as GAE now.
Then it comes to be that the soothing light at the end of your tunnel, is just a freight train coming your way...
@btcoop71
I will get you for that one coop....lol....
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions
its his alias
I wondered the same thing.
I really like the ABC
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
it is not an alias......but thanks.....it is my real name......I am easy to find......
you can look up all of my past deeds and failures online if you are so inclined to do it and spend the money to get the records. I can save you a little time and money by telling you I am basically broke….lol……and have been since I went belly up the first time in this insurance gig about 6 yrs ago……lol…..I guess I am a glutton for punishment.
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions
in theory, i like the transparency....
just don’t let it carry over to your avatar…..
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 9, 2010 12:20 PM EDT up reply actions
lol
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 12:30 PM EDT up reply actions
aka or alias is Also Known As
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
I started posting daily articles on other sites as well as here......got to be too hard to
explain who I was to others…..just made life easier. AND my momma likes it better……lol
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions
I have told everyone, I shall ALWAYS be ABC.....lol
feel free to use the moniker
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions
Good I dont know that I could stop calling you ABC - lol!
…but GAE could be fun too… ;)
It is not worth an intelligent man’s time to be in the majority. By definition, there are already enough people to do that.
by kentuckygirl0724 on Sep 9, 2010 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions
the wife has another name for me, but its taken.....so you will have to settle for ABC
or Greg…..whichever suits you.
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions
Me too Bob
I am betting he didn’t think about being GAE.
Just kidding ABC. :-)
Blue... there is no other color to Bleed !!!
by a2d2 on Sep 9, 2010 12:10 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
not once did I ever think of being GAE.......lol
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions
Well,
It does make me LOL. I always welcome a great laugh. Especially knowing you are laughing too. :-D
Blue... there is no other color to Bleed !!!
by a2d2 on Sep 9, 2010 12:19 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
To quote the immortal Charlie Daniels: Another man facinated with three letter monikers.....
Now if the CIA, and the IRS and the FCC
Found out that J. Edgar Hoover and the FBI
Owned stock in AT&T
And the UAW, and the BNO, and the AFL and the CIO
And the ICC, and the BBD’s, and the LSU and UCLA
And the OEO, and the KKK, and the PTA and the LNA
And the UPI and the IBM awwww BS.
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 12:45 PM EDT up reply actions
The 1953 NCAA Sanctions Offered Proof / Evidence
UK players in 40’s and 50’s were found to have received improper $ benefits by NCAA investigation.
Rupp was hated because he won. A LOT.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions
That too.....thanks Forty.....I should have pointed that out
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions
Rupp was hated because he won. A LOT.
Maybe something else in common with Cal?? :)
It is not worth an intelligent man’s time to be in the majority. By definition, there are already enough people to do that.
by kentuckygirl0724 on Sep 9, 2010 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions
Exactly
That’s why Cal is “hated” by some.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 11:45 AM EDT up reply actions
Even then ... we were embracing the hate ....
Wasn’t it also proven that Wooden paid players at UCLA during his time ….. ???
Sam Gilbert
But Wooden knew what was happening and ignored it….
Then it comes to be that the soothing light at the end of your tunnel, is just a freight train coming your way...
@btcoop71
lol
and of course Rupp didn’t have any idea, Right?
Tell us how you know Wooden knew and to what extent.
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
Bill Walton talked about it in his book
I’d think he’d have a good idea
Then it comes to be that the soothing light at the end of your tunnel, is just a freight train coming your way...
@btcoop71
ok so lets strip UCLA of all their wins in the Wooden era.
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
If the NCAA had balls they would have
But they were affraid of taking down their marque program
Then it comes to be that the soothing light at the end of your tunnel, is just a freight train coming your way...
@btcoop71
and the same for Duke!
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
Corey Maggette and Myron Piggy
No different than Marcus Camby at UMASS, NCAA chose not to taint Coach K
Then it comes to be that the soothing light at the end of your tunnel, is just a freight train coming your way...
@btcoop71
right and Kansas and North Carolina too!
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
Hell
if we could just get everyone to run their program as clean as we run ours they could do away with the NCAA!
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
scarasm?
Yep. But we at kentucky have no right to slam anyone’s program with our record.
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
good stuff paris...
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 9, 2010 10:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe Paris.
Or we have the right to point out that other programs share our sins, and sometimes not our punishments.
Why do you only want to tie the hands of UK fans? You never use your “wit” to attack anyone except UK fans or the UK programs and its coaches.
Great to have you on board.
Mabye Paris
Man, a great post. Really. Few words but a touching of all bases.
Cleared the fence by 10 feet.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Guy de Paris
Tell us how you know he didn’t and Rupp did.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
lol...........
Et Tu Brutus?
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Ken
Yep. Just looking the other way when others did. He said that, not me.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Forty
OK guy, now you’ve done it. That’s classified, top secret material. You will be found guilty and recieve the mandatory 50 lashes with a wet noodle. Yes, you must remove your shirt.
Couldn’t resist man. Just testing your sense of humor. Hope it is as good as your tolerance for the uninitiated. LOL
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
No Comeback
Can’t tell which post you replied to?
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 12:01 AM EDT up reply actions
are you comparing Rupp to Cal?
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
That is EXACTLY what I am doing........
same scenario……different time.
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions
NO Comparison
Rupp is among the Top 2-3 coaches EVER.
Calipari is among the Top 2-3 coaches NOW.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions
your view.....youre entitled.....as am I to mine
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions
Absolutely NO COMPARISON Between Rupp And Calipari
You embarrass yourself by doing so.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 11:44 AM EDT up reply actions
says you......look, you can call it any way you like....Calipari's
story has not yet been completely written…..
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 11:46 AM EDT up reply actions
let me get this straight though.......
You are saying that Rupp was a “cheater” but a legend??
You are saying that Cal is “Not” a cheater, and does not compare to Rupp???
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions
Not At All
Rupp >>> coach than Calipari. Not even close.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 2:17 PM EDT up reply actions
Agree With That
Calipari has 10 to 15 more years.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 2:17 PM EDT up reply actions
Enough of that, Forty.
It is a valid comparison. Rupp is clearly superior. The end.
A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan
maybe I should have said the "paths" were comparable.....???
I am not trying to say that Cal is better than Rupp….just that their careers have a lot mor similarities than we may think
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Rupp Had A Fairly Simple Path
4 years as HS coach in Illinois. 42 years as UK head coach.
Calipari took a different path, more common nowadays. 3 head coaching jobs, NBA coaching job, several years as college assisatant before all of those.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 2:19 PM EDT up reply actions
But THEN Rupp was one of the top 2-3 which was NOW then.
So Calipari is one of the top 2-3 NOW which someday will be EVER (we hope). And we get to watch it all happen SOON (but not soon enough). All of this time travel has made me tired so I am going to take a nap.
I woke up feeling BLUE this morning. It's gonna be a great day.
one had four NCAA championships, the other, well, his teams have had two Final Fours vacated. BUT we know it wasn’t his fault. Wonder what what the discussion wass between the coach who recruited Kanter and Ms. Bell?
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
My point being he was accused of a lot of things....he was guilty of none.
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions
of course not
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
just so Forty doesnt swoop down and thrash me with his talons, I was speaking metaphorically above.....
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 11:55 AM EDT up reply actions
ParisGuy…………Why? Why in the name of heaven do you have to keep bringing that up? The man was not accused of committing a single violation.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Because he is a UK fan that doesn't sugar coat anything.
He is looking to keep it real.
And by “sugar coat” and “keep it real,” I mean say anything positive ever about his team.
surely your not saying in "same scenario’ that Cal’s players are getting paid.
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.

Then it comes to be that the soothing light at the end of your tunnel, is just a freight train coming your way...
@btcoop71
Whats a matter?
someone cause you to think?
Didn’t I say Cal is innocent?
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
again, please see above......Rupp was blamed for his players taking money when he had nothing to do with it
Sound anything like Marcus Camby to you?
Difference being in those days they didnt take away champs or final fours……vacating wins is a fairly new concept.
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions
You may remember that little "incident" back in 1952 when the NCAA and The SEC
basically stopped us from playing for a year?? Those were the kinds of things they did back then. i.e. the “Death” penalty.
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions
NCAA Found Evidence They Were Paid $ At UK
Russell Rice’s book Big Blue Basketball described cases where Rupp paid $50 to Hagan and Riley.
Right or wrong, true or not, Rupp did what everybody else did back then.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions
I am surprised that $50 could be called a payment, even back in the 60's....
but the point is well taken
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions
considering how much $$$ was being rolled out in Southern California....
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions
$50 Handshakes Were Not Uncommon In 50's
And hardly just at UK either.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 2:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Friend Of Mine From Mid 1960's
Got paid $15K to attend Purdue in mid 1960’s. (His Dad sold supplies to mine)
Chuck was starting FB guard on Rose Bowl team in mid 1960’s. It paid off.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 3:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Friend of mine
So that’s how you have aquired your knowledge. From those who indulged
in questionable activities. Best source.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
More Baloney
Do you EVER have ANYTHING useful to say???
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 11, 2010 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions
Oh yeah. But you never listen just talk. Anyway you’d be surprised what I know that’s USEFUL.
And baloney/balony is one of my favorites. Was raised on a “Roll of red and a loaf of bread.” Those were the good old days of yore. Many lessons of life were learned by “OJT.” Meaning “Do as you are told or I will bust your ass.” They did too.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
But again, that was the nature of the beast in those days in good old Parkland where life was cheap. But plentiful. Always a good fight somewhere.
To survive you had to be discreet enough to be on the winners side. Hee! Hee!
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Forty……..Got a problem with “payment.” Payment, as in salary or as in simply helping a kid financially? I know it was a common practice but the money wasn’t given to them because they were threatening to leave the team or because Rupp wanted them on salary. LOL Big difference.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Read The RR Book
$50 cash handshakes. The book says Rupp gave $ to Hagan on NYC trip and $ to Riley on trip to NY also.
Later $100 cash in 70’s and 80’s.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 12:03 AM EDT up reply actions
Read the RR book
Don’t have to. R&R was covered in my military training.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
There in no way that could happen to us again.
Right?
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
Sure it could.......I don't think it will, but it could.....could happen to anyone.
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions
For a little historical reference,
Here is the bio on Coach Rupp from bigbluehistory.net
Just a couple of little excerpts on why I think he and Cal are two sides of the same coin
Quoted from Rupp in 1977:
“Gentlemen, I don’t know where basketball is going,” Rupp began in the familiar quavering voice. “I don’t think preachers are overpaid, I know they pray like hell over that collection plate, but I don’t think it’s filled. And when a preacher’s son enrolls as a freshman driving a Thunderbird, I wonder about it. When I get back home to Lexington, I’m going down to check the Thunderbird prices. I didn’t know they were in that range.”
“I think a lot about Rudyard Kipling. I remember when he was still living and an editor for the Manchester Guardian wrote that the junk Kipling was writing would never last.
“Well, it hurt Kipling,” Rupp continued. “He was greatly depressed. And while he was in that depression, he sat down and wrote the poem ’L’Envoi’.”
“When earth’s last picture is painted, and the tubes are twisted and dried.
When the oldest colors have faded, and the youngest critic has died.
We shall rest, and faith, we shall need it – lie down for an aeon or two.
Till the Master of All Good Workmen shall set us to work anew!
And those that were good will be happy; they shall sit in a golden chair;
They shall splash at a ten-league canvas with brushes of comets’ hair;
They shall find real saints to draw from – Magdalene, Peter and Paul;
They shall work for an age at a sitting and never be tired at all!
And only the Master shall praise us, and only the Master shall blame;
And no one shall work for money, and no one shall work for fame;
But each for the joy of the working, and each, in his own separate star,
Shall draw the Thing as he sees It for the God of Things as They Are!"
“Thank you.”
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 11:37 AM EDT reply actions
Congratulations, Ken
You’ve done a better job than anyone of contemporaneously (the question itself requires a value judgment and thus evolves with times and conditions) of answering the question: Is it worth it?
"People unfit for freedom -- who cannot do much with it -- are hungry for power. The desire for freedom is an attribute of a 'have' type of self. It says: leave me alone and I shall grow, learn, and realize my capacities. The desire for power is basically an attribute of a 'have not' type of self." — Eric Hoffer
Camby And Calipari At UMass
On the occasion of Marcus Camby’s induction into UMass HOF some interesting comments:
“The poor decision I made, it was definitely disappointing, not just for me but for the entire university. When I went through that, I couldn’t blame anybody but myself,” Camby said Tuesday. “When that stuff was going on, no one knew about it, no one at the university, none of my coaches or teammates. I thought the only right thing for me to do was own up to my mistakes.”
Emphasis mine
"People unfit for freedom -- who cannot do much with it -- are hungry for power. The desire for freedom is an attribute of a 'have' type of self. It says: leave me alone and I shall grow, learn, and realize my capacities. The desire for power is basically an attribute of a 'have not' type of self." — Eric Hoffer
Wonder how that will be received by the fans at large?
I dont think Cal should hold his breath waiting for apologies to come rolling in
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions
and my favorite quote from the same article
Calipari quote
"We had done everything prior. We put together a group of people to interview the agents before they could talk to our players," he said. "I was stunned. Here was a kid who lived in the dorm the whole time, never had a car, wore sweat suits the whole time and never had clothes that way. His mother lived in the same house in the projects in Hartford that she lived in the entire time he was in school. They never asked for one thing. He knew he made a mistake and he paid for it. But this was not our program issue or our university issue. This is an agent issue. This kid was preyed upon."
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 9, 2010 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions
Similar thing happening at UGA with wide receiver AJ Green .... BUT ...
Green sold his bowl game jersey …. through an “agent” for $1000 …. he had to repay the $1000 through community service and will sit out for 4 games …. “preyed upon” the kid suffers, the school and fans are punished …. – but it wasn’t Mark Richt’s fault …..
Opinion Of A Turkish Pro
I don’t think the author is identified (perhaps I missed it) but the comments are interesting.
"People unfit for freedom -- who cannot do much with it -- are hungry for power. The desire for freedom is an attribute of a 'have' type of self. It says: leave me alone and I shall grow, learn, and realize my capacities. The desire for power is basically an attribute of a 'have not' type of self." — Eric Hoffer
Perhaps A Compromise Will Be Reached
Kanter ineligible for first half of regular season?
That’s what happened to the Turkish big man at West Va U last year.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Me too ... but this case is under a microscope and the whole of the college basketball is watching ... I hope it brings about change - for the better - but I think a "precendent" will be set for other schools to refer to in the future.
ukcris…………Yeah and the NCAA sure wouldn’t want to make the wrong decision
in this case. Wouldn’t look good because they don’t understand their own policy.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
I think its another one of those sensitive areas that the NCAA waffles around ...
I mean there any number of players on Turkish teams (and other foreign leagues) who, while maybe not as gifted as Kanter, would nonetheless make an excellent player for an NCAA team and would like the chance to get publicity for an NBA contract.
"I think..........."
No disagreement here. Though some may want to segregate between a foreign player desiring to do this, what is the difference between Kanter and UK’s one and done’s? See where I’m coming from on this? If he’s here legally to play BB then any discrimination against him would not be “kosher” so to speak. Just as an aside, one and done sux.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Another great job Ken!
Reality is that college basketball continues to evolve and change just like everything else on this planet…who knows we may even beat UT this year!!;-)
Read through every post and just some observations…
First, Rupp was a legend but good, bad or indifferent he was still a coach at a border state school in a Southern conference during a time when Elvis was considered risque. Did he personally cheat? Maybe, maybe not…was he a racist? again, UK fans don’t think so but many others think he was. Bottom line any UK fan alive while he coached loved him.
Pitino…..he was truely in the right place at the right time. His style was somewhat unique at that time and he was able to recruit the players to make it work. The same coach has struggled comparitively at UofL. Every coach or period seems to get compared to Pitino but look at him now…..I live in Louisville and graduated from UofL….a LOT of UofL fans wouldn’t have been upset if he’d taken the St. John’s job.
Tubby……I along with many others give him full credit for the championship he won (along with some timely 3 pointers) but he coached Pitino’s recruits. He did recruit better than many give him credit for but we were always missing some key ingredients to win another championship. He was a classy guy but then so was Bill Curry and for those who haven’t noticed, he’s also struggling at Minnesota with much lower expectations than were on him at UK.
Cal…..I’m not a big fisherman but I do know that to put a fish dinner on the table, you usually have to make several casts and many are wasted with no bites. It seems to me that Cal is doing nothing more than casting where he thinks the biggest fish are. If Kanter turns out to be a fish that got away….isn’t is better to have tried to catch him? All this holier than thou stuff is getting old. Just like Rupp succeeded and mostly thrived in his times, Cal is attempting to do the same thing…..what more can we as UK fans expect? Just like in fishing…there are those pesky rules but until Cal is shown to have broke any of them….let the man do what he was given a big contract to do….put a damn nice fish dinner on the table!!
You can't fix "stupid"!
Thanks UKlvrJM
I really like your “fishing” analogy, and pretty much agree with your breakdown of each UK coach. But, no Sutton or Gillispie?
I’m shocked.
Mmm, I’m hungry and don’t know why:)
Now see we need
a like button like Facebook has :). Very well put! I don’ t think Rupp was anymore racist then any of the other coaches in the NCAA. Our times were very different back then. Stupidly, people thought a color of skin determined intelligence or worth as a human being. Somehow whites got the upper end of that. LIstening to people that are much much much older then me, those feelings have lessened but are still there. We have come a long way and I am proud to say that my own children and their friends don’t see the difference the way their grandparents did. That older generation racist ways were taught to them. Then the government walks in and tells them what to do. They resented it. Was it wrong to resent it….yes. It still happened though. To say that Rupp was racist because he didn’t go against the grain and allow african americans is pretty unfair. Luckily we don’ t have to deal with that any longer.
Rupp was not racist.....he coached in a racist conference.......
And the conference was racist because of where it was located.
It is semantics I know, but Rupp was as much a victim of where he was coaching as anything.
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 9, 2010 3:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Greg
Thank you for having the guts to make that statement. This is one of the biggest myths ever propagated. Rupp was his own man and didn’t care whether one agreed with him or not.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Exactly ABC and I think the EXACT same thing applies to Cal.
I don’t want to imply in anyway that racism is anything like dealing with sports agents or stupid NBA rules but just like Rupp had to deal with his era and circumstances, so does Cal.
I personally don’t think Cal is a cheater. Maybe I’m naive but I think Cal is adept at utilizing the current tools he has and does that within the rules. If Kanter was still committed to Washington this would have been a small paragraph story on page 3 of every sports section. BUT…….since it’s Cal and UK, it’s the NY Times and big news.
I don’t like the one and done’s and we all hashed that over last year but the bottom line is he’s just trying to get the best players available and being VERY successful at doing it which brings hate and envy.
My attitude about Cal is simple…….he seems to be a GREAT ambassador for the program and let’s win a championship before we start worrying about having to vacate one!!!
You can't fix "stupid"!
Little Known But
Rupp was “encouraged” to leave Freeport IL (HS team) BECAUSE he started a black player.
The guy can’t win. That was in 1930 though.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 9:49 PM EDT up reply actions
SEC Opened Up In 1964
UK suited up a black player (Tom Payne) in Dec 1970.
Prior to 64, not Rupp’s fault. After fault, his failure to successfully recruit black was his fault. He tried but failed.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 9:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Forty……..How does one get a black player to come play for him when he, the coach,
had to deal with the media bias? I have on DVD what Wes Unseld said was ONE of his reasons for turning Rupp down. Same as all cases. UK is a “dangerous place to
attend” because one might get killed there. BS.
To this day I can’t remember a single player or coach who got murdered at UK. Not then, the ’60s, or before. Still respect your opinions though.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
I've interviewed Wilbur Hackett extensively,
and believe me when I say, UK was not a pleasant place for blacks in the late ’60’s.
by Ken Howlett on Sep 10, 2010 12:02 AM EDT up reply actions
No Doubt Whatsoever
And even more dangerous in Miss, Louisiana, Ala, Ga, et all – the Deep South.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 12:08 AM EDT up reply actions
No doubt whatsoever.
A situation brought about by the illegal invasion by Honest Abe’s gansters in 1865. Satisfied now? You finally got me to bite. OK. Let’s just open up the whole stinking can of worms so I can go out “in a blaze of glory.”
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Ignoring History Allows It To Repeat
Remember but don’t repeat.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions
I've interviewed.....
I liked Wilbur Hackett but I doubt that he was Mr. Unbiased. UK is a southern state and even though it was common in the south for this kind of insensitivity
to happen, it was no less common in the north. Just not reported because of hatred for southern. Never been an equally fair reporting on their racism.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
This comment may be the dumbest assertion I've ever read on this site
Blacks didn’t prohibit whites from the workplace, or voting booth. In order to don the hat of racism, one has to have power.
Hackett was/is pained to relate some of his experiences (because he loves UK), experiences which are substantiated by some of his white teammates.
Greg Page
Not murdered (per se) but pretty close to it, some teammates claimed.
I don’t blame Rupp for not trying. He TRIED but failed. I blame him for the latter.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 12:04 AM EDT up reply actions
FortyYearCatFan
There you go with that “he tried but failed” stuff again. If the man tried, but outside influences blocked his success, how in the hell did he fail?
I was taught this as a kid, it’s better to try and sail your ship onto the open sea
than sit on your fat butt in the harbor and not even try.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
He Was Unsuccessful Then
Butch Beard should have been a Wildcat. Jim Rose, too. Felix Thruston.
He failed to successfully recruit black players.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Forty
BS
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
You’re a real trip, you are.
Haven’t you read where those players refused to play for UK because Rupp couldn’t get the university to extend more money to pay these guys to play for Kentucky?
They went to the highest bidder. Just like today. Only the amount has been changed to protect the innocent. The fans.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
I Have Not Read That But No Surprise (If True)
UK played the $ game like the rest in the 1960’s.
Rupp was unsuccessful at recruiting black players but he tried.
Trying wasn’t enough.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 8:38 PM EDT up reply actions
I saw a young UK player paralyzed in an intersquad
game in, I believe, spring 1967. My memory may not be accurate on the date, and I don’t even remember if it was Greg Page, but it was in Stoll Field during, as I recall, my sophomore year, at an intrasquad game. The young player, and I don’t even remember what color his skin was (because it didn’t matter), dived into the tackle and ducked his head and probably would have been penalized now for spearing.
I was sitting in the first row of stands and was less than 50 feet away. He dived into the tackle and hit the runner right in front of me on the south sideline. He fell so limp that my two friends and I knew it was bad. He fell like a sack of potatoes and just lay there motionless. I almost got sick watching.
The idea that he may have been murdered, if indeed it was Greg Page, is absolute bull. It was not, as reported in one of the references I googled, in shorts and pads, but was a full-up play from scrimmage in an intersquad game. I’m sure Nat Northington was suspicious because of the general atmosphere in the South in those days, and I certainly don’t blame him for that after what he went through, but his assertion is wrong if this incident that I witnessed was the Greg Page injury. I saw it personally, and it was like it was in slow motion when the player fell limp on the field. I don’t like to think about it.
"The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena . . .who spends himself for a worthy cause . . ."
Page
Was injured in a drill where 11 players tackled 1 player. Every player did the drill. He died about a month later. Northington left campus the next day.
The incident you may have witness sounds different than the Page injury.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 8:45 PM EDT up reply actions
were you there? It's a stretch to believe
that two players were paralyzed in such a short period of time, don’t you think? Where did you get your info?
"The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena . . .who spends himself for a worthy cause . . ."
and I didn't freakin' "may have" witnessed.
"The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena . . .who spends himself for a worthy cause . . ."
No Edit Function
Once I type it, I can’t take an extra word (may) out.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 10:26 PM EDT up reply actions
The Page Injury Has Been Well Documented
It was a regular drill that all players performed.
11 guys tackle 1 guy.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 10:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Clipped (SI Article Nov 2005)
So it was that the color barrier remained intact for SEC football until 1966. Logically enough, the task of breaking it fell to Kentucky, a border state that had desegregated its public schools in 1948. The Wildcats recruited defensive end Greg Page and receiver Nat Northington, and in those days of freshman ineligibility, the two spent a year patiently waiting for their breakthrough.
It was a high August afternoon in 1967 when Kentucky ran a pursuit drill, a staple of its preseason practices that was prejudiced against no one but the ballcarrier. In it, all 11 Wildcats defenders were to converge on the ball and get in a pop or a butt before dispersing. But this time Page fell to the turf and failed to rise. Something terrible had happened in that clattering of strong young men in helmets and pads and shorts, something that left Page paralyzed from the nose down.
At first events unspooled quickly: mouth-to-mouth, hospitalization, a tracheotomy, a respirator. And then agonizingly slowly, until, 38 days later, as the pastor at the memorial service put it, “the rudest of all constables whisked him away.” Greg Page died on a Friday night. The next afternoon his roommate, Northington, became the first African-American to play in an SEC varsity football game, logging several minutes as a wideout in a home loss to Ole Miss. But within weeks he fled Lexington in a fog of distress and loneliness, leaving the Kentucky varsity all-white once more. “Nat said he’d just sit in his room and talk to the bricks in the wall,” remembers Wilbur Hackett, a black linebacker who had been practicing with the freshman team on an adjacent field when Page went down. “Nat didn’t feel close enough to anyone else, and nobody came to him. And the only reason I was at the school was because of Nat and Greg.” Only Northington’s pleas with Hackett and the other black freshman, Houston Hogg, to stay—urgings as resolute as his own decision to go—kept the two freshmen at Kentucky.
When Hackett told friends back in Louisville’s West End that he would be returning to Kentucky for his sophomore year, they looked at him cross-eyed. “It was like, ‘Man, you gonna stay where they killed Greg Page?’” he remembers. “That’s what the feeling was.”
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Clipped
Horse manure! Never proven to be true. Who were the culprits/culprit? Oh yeah, it was in one of these Stanley
Straightarrow rags. They wouldn’t distort or warp the truth.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Clipped Means
A snippet of the article was “clipped” and pasted here.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 11, 2010 8:23 AM EDT up reply actions
Naaaaaaaaaaw! You don’t say.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Clipped Also Has Football Meaning
Just wanted to be clear that Page was not "clipped in that sense.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 11, 2010 9:54 AM EDT up reply actions
You are ate up with it.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Learn Basic English And Grammar
Eaten up with it.
You perpetuate the KY stereotype otherwise.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 11, 2010 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions
This from you, “The Great Speller?” He of
the baser sort? Told you once man, I was born in the east end and raised in the east and west ends of Louisville. We weren’t into that “spelling thing” back then. We had other things to do. Like how to prey upon one’s neighbor’s. After all if they had more than we did they should have to share it with us. Wealth distribution don’t you know?
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
oldcat'69
A most horrible experience to be sure. I can identify with it. Like standing at the bedside in a Ft. Worth hospital while I watched my wife’s 7 year old cousin turn deep blue when she drew her last breath. She had 3rd degree
burns over 70 % of her body. I happened to be the only one in her room at the time. I called for the nurse and even though she desperately tried to revive her, she wasn’t able to do so.
There are many people who have seen things much worse than these. It doesn’t soften the impact of our experience but it can help us to appreciate
that others have been there and seen that.
Thanks for relating your experience. Believe me, my heart, which many people think I do not possess, goes out to you.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
A Couple Of Football Players Were Murdered In Late 1990's
I forget their names.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 12:07 AM EDT up reply actions
Under Curry Trent DiGiurdo (sp?) was murdered in ... '93, '94, '95
something like that. And in ’97 or ’98 the center on the football team was hit by a train and killed right there next to campus. That incident is what led to the zero tolerance policy concerning alcohol.
Page — Hackett was on the field when Page broke his neck, and he didn’t say anything to me which indicated he thought anyone had done anything intentional to hurt Page. And, yes, I asked.
by Ken Howlett on Sep 10, 2010 12:19 AM EDT up reply actions
To The Latter Point
I’ve read claims from other teammate(s) that some felt it was intentional.
No way to know now.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 7:07 AM EDT up reply actions
Certainly possible
I’ve talked to Houston Hogg and Hackett, but there were dozens of players on the field when it happened.
Nat Northington
He was one of those that I’m referring to.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 11:57 AM EDT up reply actions
Northington was Page's best friend and roommate,
something you may already know.
I haven’t spoken to him, but from what I know about him, it doesn’t surprise me he thinks something was purposely done to hurt Page. From what I know of him, he’s an extremely intelligent guy, a deep thinker (so to speak), so I doubt he would throw around accusations without genuinely feeling they are true.
He was pretty grief-stricken over Page’s death, which is one of the reasons he transferred to WKU.
Northington is a very private person, but I would love to talk to him sometime.
by Ken Howlett on Sep 10, 2010 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Northington....
Feeling? Don’t you know anything but BB? Try to get a conviction in a court of law on “feelings.” The defense attorney would run your tail out of Lexington. Feelings are heresay.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Certainly possible.
Murdered by whom? His own teamates in front of tens of thousands of fans and players from both teams?
Heresay. Heresay. Heresay.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
FortyYearKnatFan
Not so. When in the court room the room is referred to as “here”, meaning the room itself. When something is said that lacks subtiantial evidence it is called “say.”
Thus “heresay” because it was said in the court room. That’s
simple enough, isn’t it?
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Sorry, Not So
HEARsay means it was heard by one from another but no other proof.
So far as I know, no such thing as HEREsay.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 8:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Lord have mercy. You are ate up with it.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Clipped
Hearsay is information gathered by one person from another concerning some event, condition, or thing of which the first person had no direct experience. When submitted as evidence, such statements are called hearsay evidence. As a legal term, “hearsay” can also have the narrower meaning of the use of such information as evidence to prove the truth of what is asserted. Such use of “hearsay evidence” in court is generally not allowed. This prohibition is called the hearsay rule.For example, a witness says “Susan told me Tom was in town”. Since the witness did not see Tom in town, the statement would be hearsay evidence to the fact that Tom was in town, and not admissible. However, it would be admissible as evidence that Susan said Tom was in town, and on the issue of her knowledge of whether he was in town.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 8:43 PM EDT up reply actions
And I mean TOTALLY ate up with the dumb
_ _ _. No doubt about it. Much learning doth make thee mad.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Offering Facts
Couldn’t find “heresay” anywhere.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 8:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Offering facts
That’s because you never lived in the Parkland area of Louisville, KY. We often communicated in secret codes. Heresay was just one of them.
Another was called English. Of course we only used that when we were talking about things that were not classified.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Where are you from? Or do you even know? Bet your family were share croppers.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Northern KY
My Dad lived in rural Visalia KY growing up.
No share croppers in the family. Potato chippers instead.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 11, 2010 9:57 AM EDT up reply actions
To the latter point.
Yeah. You would.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
To the......
Read them where? In Louisville Courier Journal rag? Yeah, right.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Yeah. I remember that. There was a row in the locker after a costly loss and a player (can’t remember his name) got an Uzzi out of his locker and hosed these guys down.
Terrible incident.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
This is a fine post, UKlvrJM
Like you, I give Tubby full credit for the 98 Championship. Many say he did it with Pitino’s recruits, and that’s true, but few care to note that Pitino had a more talented squad the prior year that did not make it over the final hurdle. I don’t think Ricky could have taken the 98 squad as far as Tubby did.
Question—when Tubby was an assistant to Pitino in the early 90s, did he participate in recruiting? I just can’t remember.
Based on my recollection
Tubby only assisted Pitino one year before taking the head coaching job at Tulsa. He wouldn’t have been involved in much recruiting under Pitino, in fact, only a partial year of the recruiting season.
Yes, Tubby Was CHIEF Recruiter At UK In 1990 And 1991
He helped UK land 1990 recruits (Mashburn, Martinez, Toomer, Ford) and 1991 recruits (Riddick, Timberlake, Harrison, Brown).
Those 8 included 3 HS A-A and 1 JuCo A-A.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 9, 2010 10:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Thanks, I have frequently seen it written on websites
That Tubby “never recruited a player who made a final four” and always found that questionable.
The Latter Part Isn't True, Either
Saul Smith was recruited (on scholarship) in May 1997 and was back-up PG on 1998 FF team.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Yes, Tubby....
Chief Recruiter; that’s the highest position in the NCAA tribe, isn’t it?
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Actually
Div I teams usually have 1 of 3 assistants designated as lead recruiter.
Pitino (at UK) had Tubby in 90 & 91, Donovan in 92-93-94, and Delray Brooks in 95-96-97.
Tubby (at UK) had George Felton in 98-99-2000, for example.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 11, 2010 8:26 AM EDT up reply actions
My point exactly. He was elevated from brave to the “Chief.”
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
He Was Also Chief Recruiter At South Carolina In Late 80's
Those Gamecock teams were pretty talented and made their first NCAA appearance in almost 20 years.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 11, 2010 10:05 AM EDT up reply actions
Man! It’s great to hear that. I’ve been wondering if mabye he had had another “Chief” position somewhere. I’ll be sure and add it to my upcoming book, “Memoirs Of A Giant, The Untold Story of Tubby Smith.”
Of course I don’t expect it to be a best seller around these parts, but it may have some historical impact on basketball history. You never can tell.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Almost forgot. I really do wish Tubby the best. Afterall he was a UK coach. Will never forget it.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
And A DAMN Good One
Like almost all of them were.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 11, 2010 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions
Tubby ... you have to give him credit ... two things 1) he was one of Rick's assistants so he was familiar with running the system and with the players 2)Any coach that can take a team to the FF, much less win the whole thing, has earned it ..
no matter what the circumstances ….
ukcris…..The 1998 team basically coached itself. Super stars? None. A well disciplined bunch of team oriented players? All of them. Tubby kept them focused on that principle and
didn’t try to fix what was not broke. He did not have to teach those guys how to play defense
but simply keep them on the right path, since he was, in estimation, one of the best defensive coaches I have ever seen.
After the 1998 season, most of the losses were due to a lack of points not defense.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Coached Itself???
Completely untrue.
The team jelled once they finally bought into Tubby’s system and ran off 13 straight W.
UK had good offensive teams after 1998. Some not so good.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 12:06 AM EDT up reply actions
Bingo, according to both Mills and Shep
by Ken Howlett on Sep 10, 2010 12:14 AM EDT up reply actions
You know guys, believe it or not, I can read. But at this point in my life about all I am really interested in is MY Wildcats and coach Cal and # 8 if it happens.
They are my Wildcats too. You might say that I’m a “SixtyTwoYearCatFan.”
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
I give Tubby credit for the NC, but I'll say this ---
In ’98 he pressed quite a bit. That is, he ran a quasi-Pitino system.
After ’98, that all but disappeared in favor of the ball-line defense. Almost never ran a good press again.
I think that had a lot to do with what the player in ’98 learned under Pitino. That press was necessary or there would have been no “Comeback Cats.”
PerhapsSo
But other UK teams under T had good defensive numbers. The 2003 team, for EG.
Even P doesn’t press any more.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 7:09 AM EDT up reply actions
Whoop-De-Doo
Last year’s U of L team was 21-13.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 11:58 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Whoop-de-doo.
That’s true, Ken. But at least they won 21.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Ken
OK. I apoligize for the mix up. I am signing off now because I’m absolutely pissed off now. I tried my butt off to play it straight but I knew it wasn’t going to workout. Been there and done that.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
we've all been there....
part of the initiation to ASoB – you have to go round and round with 40…
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 11, 2010 12:00 AM EDT up reply actions
We've....
Sorry memphis, but I’m not obligated to do that. If turning
a wild man loose on a new member is an initiation then there is no hope anymore for logic. Only a rampant running amuck of the brain.
If you’re serious, thank you. If not, thank you anyway.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
My Point Being...
Forty is part of the family around here – sometimes the beloved uncle, sometimes the crazy uncle – just depends on what side you are on.
About the time you get ready to give up on him, he will recite a bunch of “clipped facts” that support exactly the point you have been trying to make
I get as frustrated with Forty as the next guy (and i know he gets frustrated with me), but i have learned to appreciate what he has to say – even as i appreciate what you have to say
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 11, 2010 8:24 AM EDT up reply actions
for the love.
First of all, if you think Forty is a wild man in this thread, let me just go and get you a mirror. Have you actually read some of the comments you have posted here? They are/were downright mean to people. You give just as good as you get, sir, so forgive me if I’m not going to join in your little pity party. Debate a topic, sure, debate it all darn day until Ken or Tru asks you to stop, but don’t personally attack people, attack a subject. {sigh}
Also, this has absolutely nothing to do with your member status. This is a blog. People give opinions here, some agreeing opinions, and some not agreeing opinions. It’s really not a big deal and you would be well served to not take things too personally. Forty doesn’t mean it personally. He is giving his opinion, and yes, I will agree that after awhile the back and forth does get a bit tiresome — but if it bothers you so much I would suggest that you just stop commenting and he will be forced to stop, as well. See how that works, if you don’t respond he has no one to go back and forth with.
I apologize to everyone else for the mini-rant. This thread just got to that point for me, you know?
I was expecting the “you’re mean” politically correct
BS to start.
My heart is pumping urine. Forty doesn’t know what he means.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
well,
to be totally honest, I don’t know what you mean like 90% of the time.
Like this line for example: “My heart is pumping urine”. Now, I don’t know what that means? Does that mean you are super mad at me? I don’t know, but if so then I would say that you anger quite easily and it’s really kinda scary to me.
And, expecting people to be polite isn’t politically correct BS. The fact that this blog is politically correct at least in its effort to try and keep things respectful is one of the things that drew me to it. If I wanted to read stuff like "I don’t respect a single word you just wrote" and "You need a big whack with an intelligent stick" post after post, well, I’d head on over to Yahoo Sports or something similar. Demanding respectful posts shouldn’t be scoffed at and certainly isn’t too much to ask, IMO.
by BigSkyCat on Sep 11, 2010 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Thank you for the analytical observation of my mental health. I’m not MAD at anyone and no, I do not have a criminal record. Never even been arrested except for going over the speed limit.
Can’t go to Yahoo either. They are one of the biggest malware distributors on the internet. I kid you not.
I might also add that when I look into a mirror what I see is one helluva of a man. You see there’s an old saying that goes like this, “No one can make me feel inferior without my consent.”
And I might add, be very, very careful with your implications of people’s anger to the point of doing you harm. You just may be called upon to prove it.
And lastly, this in regards to the first part of your comment. I never reveal “trade” secrets.
To do so would be extremely foolhardly. Been there and done that too.
Over and out.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Oh BigSkyCat. I forget that some of the bloggers on ASoB are at a disadvantage when it comes to many of my phrases.
They come from the time frame that I was raised in.
It is a mistake to expect you to know what,
“a big whack with an intelligent stick” means. You see back then (the ’50s) guys ran around in groups of as many as 4-6. We
were always harassing each other in a sort
of brotherly way.
For instance, if the subject was about how “cool” one of us was, another would without hesitation say, “Yeah man, you are about as cool as a mashed potato sandwich.” The meaning was who wants to eat a mashed potato sandwich? Nobody. It’s not cool.
Another was, “Hey guys, look at that cat. He must have been hit with an ugly stick.” etc.
It was a much more carefree time than today. Street smart did not mean what it does today, thankfully. We were mischievious, caused our parents and teachers problems and took chances that we should’nt have. A few of my friends went to prison, one for 1st degree murder after I left KY for Texas in 1959.
No we weren’t perfect by any stretch of the imagination. In fact most of the boys were rebellious as hell. It often got us into trouble.
But thankfully most of us made it and became useful individuals in our society. I seldom reveal this fact, but I still have a mischievous streak. Just one of those things I guess.
Sorry for writing a book. I know it’s off subject
but felt compelled to try and explain.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Dynasty Defender
I recognize pretty easily. Louisville was a dead giveaway.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 11, 2010 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions
indeed it did
This thread also needs something else…like, say, a mercy killing…says the person who responded on it again, thereby extending it further ;)
And I’m so happy to finally see your pretty smiling face, a2d2!!
by blue kentucky girl on Sep 11, 2010 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions
I totally agree
And yes, I thought it was time to show my blueness! :-)
Blue... there is no other color to Bleed !!!
Last year’s UL record is irrelevant. You said, “Even P doesn’t press any more.” My point is that UL still presses. If you watch their games the last two years, I suppose you will agree.
He Is Not As Good A Coach As 15 Years Ago
ZERO doubt about that. P is on his way Over The Hill.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions
how do you draw that conclusion?
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
Numbers Are Pretty Obvious
219-50 in the 1990’s.
220-85 in the 2000’s.
On his way over the hill. Not there yet, but headed that way.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 8:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Like I said, the man is ate up with it. Now he has set himself to determine that Pitino is heading over the hill.
Don’t sell him short 39+1. He’s not even close to John Wooden’s age yet. Pitino is truly one of the greats. Why? Because he coached at UK. I’m surprised at your audacity!! Making a remark like that about a former UK coach.
Ah, but then nobody is above your scrutinization. Nicht war?
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
LOL
Good one. One of the greats OF THE 1990’S no doubt.
Wooden won 10 NC and made 12 FF in his last 14 years of coaching.
Somehow I don’t think Pitino will do that. Dream on.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 10:24 PM EDT up reply actions
LOL
Even if I did dream about this stuff you would be my
worst nightmare. And alas, I have no hay to feed you.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Wooden was 65 when he retired
and Pitino will be 58 in mid-Sept.
by Ken Howlett on Sep 11, 2010 12:33 AM EDT up reply actions
clipped ....
ANAL … of, relating to, characterized by, or being personality traits (as parsimony, meticulousness, and ill humor) considered typical of fixation at the anal stage of development
You guys are wasting your time …. :)
Are you people so serious that you can’t discern when you are being dazzled with BS?
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Not So
Facts supporting opinions or points of view aren’t BS.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 11, 2010 8:27 AM EDT up reply actions
By Golly
Pitino better win the next 7 NCAA titles then.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 11, 2010 8:27 AM EDT up reply actions
OOPS I Was Wrong
They were only 20-13 last year. Tough year for P all around.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 11, 2010 9:53 AM EDT up reply actions
Naw. You weren’t wrong. The NCAA made a mistake. You NEVER make a mistake. Of course I’m not stupid you know. I’m aware of what you’re doing.
You think that you are really overwhelming my intelligence with your superior knowledge. Ain’t gonna happen. Been there and done that
too.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Thanks Jack. Your estimation is correct. Tubby Smith was just a man, not a Greek or Roman god. Simply because he WAS one of UK’s good coaches does not mean that the fans have to accept his faults any more than they did any other coach.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
JackBluto
You’re right Jack. He does get credit for the NC. But Tubby had an exceptional group of young men there regardless of who the former coach was. BB players are coached to think like the coach would think if he were on the court playing.
As I stated earlier this team had no superstars. That’s why they racked up # 7. The ’98 team WAS a team. They functioned like a family. Each member helping the other wether asked to or not. My favorite UK team of all time simply because of this fact.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
1998 Team
1 McDonalds A-A. 2 more Parade A-A.
Total of 3 HS A-A = the fewest on UK roster since 1991.
Only Sheppard (1995), Nazr and Magloire (1997), and Padgett (1997 second semester) had ever started for UK.
None had made All-SEC. None averaged 10+ ppg.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 10, 2010 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions
1998 Team
Still didn’t have any superstars. Didn’t need them. Had already been coached by a great coach (at that time of course) and a suitable coach continued the tradition. Tubby was qualified to coach. At Tulsa, Georgia and Minnesota. That’’s about it.
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Baloney
He matched or exceeded UK standards in W-L % and NCAA games.
Again 5 of the players on 1998 team had NOT been coached by Pitino.
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 11, 2010 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions
Ok
I just don’t understand how a kid can be a pro so young. So what if he made money outside of this country? SO WHAT???!!! HE IS A KID!!!!
obviously the turks need david stern looking after their kids.....
only one rule in my house - uk has to be your favorite college bball team
by memphis wildcat on Sep 9, 2010 3:15 PM EDT up reply actions
No, What The Anatolians Need Is
A TPBA, never thought I’d ever endorse a union.
"People unfit for freedom -- who cannot do much with it -- are hungry for power. The desire for freedom is an attribute of a 'have' type of self. It says: leave me alone and I shall grow, learn, and realize my capacities. The desire for power is basically an attribute of a 'have not' type of self." — Eric Hoffer
damn.......
that was a lot of comments to read
Tennessee basketball being investigated by NCAA
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=5552505
Then it comes to be that the soothing light at the end of your tunnel, is just a freight train coming your way...
@btcoop71
Just a comment.
Mark my words. The NCAA is going to take this new rage and totally over do it!
Happy days are here again,
The skies are Wildcat Blue again,
We've got the best recruits again,
Happy days are here again.
Are we still playing football on Saturday?
Tip-off is at 7:30, right?
On a serious note, I’m reading TV coverage might be hard to come by, even for you folks in the Commonwealth. If that’s the case all of us in the great UK diaspora are pretty much screwed (?). Please don’t tell me it’s another year of Justin.tv?
And for all of us Time Warner Cable slaves…. I got an e-mail from them that said their new agreement with Disney/ABC/ESPN will include ESPN360. As usual, they were pretty vague. Anybody have info on that?
No matter where you're at, there you are
I don't get the game :-(
But I have word out to folks with different sports packages, trying to find a viewing. They say they will check(?) I do not understand why it isn’t a priority!
7:30 yes sir, cincy. Might be a sloppy one in the rain. Go ’Cats!!
Blue... there is no other color to Bleed !!!
Well, we do need the rain
I washed the car and rolled the windows down so we’d get a good soaking. :)
No matter where you're at, there you are
Pitying the fool
Simply put, pity the fool who fails to realize the righteous truth of Kentucky basketball as being all-important to the Commonwealth.
272 comments and NO ONE gives a Mr. T. shout out for this quote? Where are my fellow children of the 80’s? Am I the only one who, at 3 or 4 years old, thought Mr. T. was the coolest person on planet Earth? (Of course, I now realize that he just barely gets edged by Chuck Norris!)
LOL!
Mr. T not the draw he once was, I suppose … pity us :)
by Ken Howlett on Sep 10, 2010 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions
I am not going to bemoan the fact that you were 3-4 when Mr.T was popular......
makes me feel old….lol
I Shall Always Be The Cat......In The Hat!!! The Artist Formerly Known As ABC!
by Greg Alan Edwards on Sep 10, 2010 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions
Greg Page
I attented several of Charlie Bradshaw’s practices and they, by far, were the most brutal displays of mistreatment I have ever seen.
I don’t think any of us know exactly how Page was injuried but if you do please inlighten us.
I saw an All State player from from of the most highly recognized programs in the state have his helmet jerked off and punched in the face by an assistant coach for missing a block. I was within five yards of this and hear the belittling because he bled. That was just one of the acts I saw and the injury to Page could have been from poorly run drills or anything . So go lightly on the word ‘murdered’.
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
Paris, please see my post above.
I didn’t look deep enough to see your question.
"The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena . . .who spends himself for a worthy cause . . ."
I was a senior in high school.
What do you think? 1965
I have be correctly accused of having a 'football fetish'. You know, someone who doesn't think football is the warm up sport to basketball season.
I haven't been on this site since Bball season...
But I check it regularly. Had to post… We have veered from Al McGuire conversation, but I have one meeting with Al to report: I was a biochem major at UK in 1980 (I’m old…now a doc in ATL area) and he was in Brooking’s one day eating his favorite food, chili. He loved chili at Brooking’s despite the fact that Rupp’s picture was up everywhere (Al and the Baron did not get along). I was eating a bowl at the counter and having an ice cold Stroh’s with it (they only had Stroh’s on tap), when I noticed him sitting in a booth. I asked him if he thought the waitresses ankles were dirty… and he said, “Yeah…this is some great chili so they must be filthy!” (reference his famous quote about waitresses’ ankles and quality of chili…). What a great man, and truly an icon of a bygone era of coaches…in the lovably-lunatic category like Dale Brown, Jimmy V, or Rollie M. (notice exclusion of Knight, as I did say lunatic, but also said lovably…). Great to see the McGuire quote. Thanks, Ken
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.
Great story
I’ve heard for years that McGuire loved the chili at Brooking’s, but I’ve never heard anyone say they ran into him there. Cool encounter, for sure.
by Ken Howlett on Sep 11, 2010 12:31 AM EDT up reply actions
McGuire In 1985
Weren’t there rumors that McGuire might succeed Joe Hall in 1985?
by FortyYearCatFan on Sep 11, 2010 8:31 AM EDT reply actions

















