Kentucky Basketball: Jerry Tipton Attempts to Explain the NCAA Eligibility Process
Jerry Tipton, the redoubtable, frequently criticized, and often loathed Lexington Herald-Leader sports columnist tries to explain the NCAA eligibility process to the Big Blue Nation in the wake of revelations that the Alabama High School Athletic Association are conducting a preliminary inquiry into the Eric Bledsoe matter to see if it warrants further investigation.
First of all, I think Tipton does a creditable job on a subject that is bound to raise the hackles of many Wildcat fans. I know that many of you think Tipton has it in for Kentucky, and I won't try to change your mind about that. I know that some of you have it in for the NCAA, and I'm not trying to change you mind on that. Rather, I intend to examine what he wrote and comment on it, and as usual, I invite you to do the same.
Tipton attempts to answer the question: "How can a school like UK face potential punishment for playing a player originally ruled eligible?" To Tipton's credit, I think it is high time somebody looked into this question. As usual, though, the answers leave the reader wanting more.
We have to read down through a recitation of background until we get to the meat of the article, which begins with this paragraph:
When asked how controversial this 180-degree change in status can be, NCAA spokesman Chuck Wynne said, "You have to remember their membership in the Eligibility Center. One of the reasons (schools) wanted it is they wanted more consistency and standardization in the decision-making process. And they wanted to get it out of an individual school's hands to make decisions."
I think most Kentucky fans would agree the concept behind this is laudable. By removing the subjectivity of a school who wants a recruit from the decision making process to any degree, you reduce the probability that a given school will be able to overlook inconsistencies that should give them pause, or rationalize them away.
The article continues to explain that there are some 55 people at the NCAA Eligibility Center reviewing the information of around 90,000 prospective student athletes (PSA's) every year. Even using Shelbyville math, that comes out to around 1636 transcripts per reviewer. If each review takes an hour, the review process would take approximately 41 weeks. Considering there are only 52 weeks in the year at least two of which must be vacation and other days off, that leaves only 9 weeks for "extensive" reviews and everything else.
Even a cursory check of an academic transcript would take 15-30 minutes at least, so it isn't hard to understand that the NCAA does not do an exhaustive review of many athletes, and it's easy to understand that the reviews done for most athletes is truly cursory. The real purpose of this review is just to find records that should be reviewed more closely, i.e. "flagged," for a longer and more in-depth look, which Wynne says is done for "hundreds" of athletes every year.
As we know, Eric Bledsoe was one of the transcripts flagged for review, and understandably so due to a notable increase in his academic performance, which is one of the things that the NCAA looks for in its preliminary review. Tipton's article also explains the extensive review process:
John Shukie, the NCAA's director of academic and membership services, said such transcripts are transferred from the Eligibility Center for the extensive review at the NCAA headquarters. The NCAA may ask for a statement from the athlete and from academic officials at the high school, he said.
The affected college can be involved. "A lot of times they act as a conduit, getting information from the high school, tracking down information from the student-athlete," Shukie said.
This makes sense. The extensive review follows up on the issues flagged by the cursory review. Shukie's comments indicate that Bledsoe would have been asked about his improvement, along with the school and possibly the coach. Interestingly enough, Bledsoe's high school coach at the time, Maurice Ford, says that he has proof that Bledsoe did the work:
"This kid has proof of his work," said Ford, who coached a high school team from Huntsville, Ala., this past season. "We kept all of that (schoolwork) just in case."
Obviously, we'll know more after the AHSAA decides on whether to open a further investigation, but at this point, assuming Ford really does have documentation of Bledsoe's work that would satisfy the questioners, it seems that the NCAA would be hard pressed to declare Bledsoe ineligible for that reason. But that is speculation, not fact.
Continuing with the NCAA outlook, things start to get dicey here:
When asked what he'd say to critics of a system that can punish college programs for playing a player initially ruled eligible, Wynne noted the objective of being fair to the school in question and its athletic opponents.
"If a certain nation in a Southern state that really loves basketball is upset, what we're concerned about is we have fairness across the board for everyone," Wynne said. "We don't have it in for anybody. What we're trying to do is make it fair for everybody."
Here is where Wynne's credibility begins to break down a bit with me. He is suggesting that the NCAA process is so "fair," it doesn't take into account the profile of the recruit or the profile of the school recruiting him.
I'm not calling Wynne a liar here, but I am skeptical of this comment and I hope it is inaccurate, or at least, incomplete. Think about it for a moment -- if the NCAA does not consider a recruit's profile or the NCAA compliance record of the school trying to offer him a scholarship, it is redolent of the idiocy of strip-searching little old Caucasian ladies when screening for terrorists
Wynne cannot be seriously suggesting that "violation profiling" is as off-limits as ethnic or racial profiling. That would be absurd, and introduce even more inefficiency into a system that can afford none. It is, for lack of a better word, incompetent.
Fairness is important, of course, but fairness does not require that you put on blinders and pick things at random. If the NCAA wants to be taken seriously, they should consider all factors when determining the scope of the review they are doing. Am I suggesting UK's recruits should be more closely looked at? Well, maybe yes and maybe no -- UK has been clean of major violations for a long time now. But should it consider the high profile of the recruit, and the high profile of UK? Sure it should. That isn't unfair -- it's basic common sense.
But the bottom line is this: If the NCAA is going to insert itself into the eligibility process this far, they have to be accountable for their decision. What many are suggesting is that the Rose case proves that they will not accept responsibility for their decision, and that Bledsoe's multiple review is just like Rose's review.
That line of reasoning is mistaken. The NCAA knows it cannot abjure responsibility for its decision and shift that responsibility to the school, no matter what anyone else tells you. In every case, the blessing of third parties affect the validity of a finding of eligibility -- in the Rose case, it is ETS. In the Bledsoe case, it is the Alabama high school education establishment.
What this means is that absent a finding by the AHSAA that Bledsoe was academically ineligible, or the ETS finds some impropriety in his college entrance exam, Bledsoe should be clear of a possible NCAA reversal on academic grounds. This says nothing, however, about the other allegations in this case which are beyond the scope of this article.
Okay, I'm done. Off to Myrtle Beach for vacation. My next essay will be from there.
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Well Tru......I guess we both had the same idea this morning.....lol....
I AM THE CAT......The Cat In The Hat!!!
Oh, heh.
I didn’t even notice.
I confess, I rarely look at fanposts until later in the day. But I’m sure your take was quite different from mine.
A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan
hehehe....other than I compared Wynne to Inspector Clouseau....not really.....lol
I AM THE CAT......The Cat In The Hat!!!
I just really don't know what would make some people happy.
First of all, Tipton’s article is not really an interview piece on Wynn. I doubt that his entire answers or complete answers are captured in his article. Therefore, some of the details may be lost in his translation.
Is the NCAA perfect? Or are their processes perfect? Probably not. However, I haven’t seen any practical suggestions either especially given the number of submittals and the legal limitations when it comes to potential investigations.
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
I would accept that Hoze except for one thing......
the statement he made at the end of the article which backhandedly references Kentucky was one of those “screw you” statements made by folks while they snicker…..
Here is a simple approach. Double/triple/quadruple the staff at the National Eligibility Center, whatever it takes, to do complete and thorough checks on all submissions. It is not like the NCAA cannot afford it. But if the NCAA says it cannot, then pass those costs back to the schools. That way the school knows if it recruits a kid who may throw up red flags that there is a financial cost that may be returned to them. I want them to stop making excuses for poor work and lousy results. To sit in that man’s position and say, “my people are overworked and underpaid” (paraphrasing here) is a joke, and so is he.
I AM THE CAT......The Cat In The Hat!!!
What makes you think that the NCAA can afford it?
The NCAA is sponsored and supported by it’s members….the schools themselves. I know you realize this, but I think you’d do yourself a favor to remind yourself. It’s not a police-state.
More money and more staff is rarely the answer…even if money and people grew on trees. You have situations with these kids like Rose (I won’t say Bledsoe…yet) and their associates conspiring to break the rules. The association works on the principle that students and the schools follow the rules. The cheaters’ transgressions are not always apparent on the first pass. When new information arises….what do you want them to do? Ignore it and congratulate the kid and/or school and say ‘…good for you, you fooled us…’?
And to call someone you really don’t know a joke based on a two or three sentence quote is unfair at best, and at worse an even bigger joke.
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Jun 4, 2010 4:17 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
you seen their balance sheets lately???
But, let’s say for the sake of arguments that they cannot afford it…..as I posted above, and you seem to have ignored…….
But if the NCAA says it cannot, then pass those costs back to the schools. That way the school knows if it recruits a kid who may throw up red flags that there is a financial cost that may be returned to them. I want them to stop making excuses for poor
work and lousy results.
And if he doesnt like the comments then he can do a better job…..fair or not…..I didnt take the job, he did. He is the one who has to earn that paycheck, not me. You get more personnel and more money when you are behind the 8-ball at work, or do you simply have to work harder to get the job done?
No pass from me on this one….it is his job, he needs to do it and do it well, or get the axe and have someone else do it. That’s what will happen to anyone his incompetence will cause to be fired.
I AM THE CAT......The Cat In The Hat!!!
Balance sheets?
Funny you should ask. Try this one.
Or if you want pretty pie charts you can look at expenses and revenues.
They’ve got the money – plenty. Right now the total administration expense of the NCAA looks like about 19.4% and that would include all salaries, rent utilities, insurance – the whole shebang. If they hired 200 people at $60K/year their expenses would jump to only to 21.1%. If you’ll notice they are doing so well there is not even income listed for member dues, just television and investments. In essence, they have the resources to implement whatever they need to provide a thorough, equitable review process.
Operational expenses or costs are typically between 20% to 25% of revenue.
Therefore they appear to be right in line with most businesses/organizations.
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Jun 4, 2010 5:56 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
The NCAA does not exist for the purpose of
making a profit. They exist to moderate the activities of their member institutions. And I don’t care what the answer is, they simply need to find it. And fix it. More people, better people, matters not to me. And if you want to bypass the cost then make the member schools pay for it. No one has their own compliance people, everyone goes through the NCAA. And they pay as they go.
I AM THE CAT......The Cat In The Hat!!!
by ALLBLUCAT on Jun 4, 2010 8:37 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Why do I believe
if operational expenditures account for approx 20 to 25% of revenues and the rest is divided amongst member institutions why do members have worry about a recruit really being eligible (or not) years down the road? If the NCAA is going to hang out a shingle stating their supremecy in all matters then they need to have some accountability… they can’t just blame it on the previous administration… what is the pisser… we gotta find out about stuff like this from bozos like tipton, forde, clay, nyt, h/l and the likes who have their sensational slant on the story to sell newspapers… I always thought if your ass was broke, busted, out of money or bankrupt, you’rre outta business… wonder how much of the “obama stimulus money” they got?
More headcount will not address the root cause.
It will not reduce the amount of time when new information is brought forth. Remember, again, most of the cheaters try hard to cover their tracks. There are bad people out there, folks.
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Jun 4, 2010 6:13 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Fine, don't hire more, hire better personnel.
Teach them how to do it right.
I AM THE CAT......The Cat In The Hat!!!
by ALLBLUCAT on Jun 4, 2010 8:39 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
If my first answer to a problem or shortfall...
….was more money or headcount, I’d be fired. And rightly so.
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Jun 4, 2010 5:51 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Well,
I think your question was “What makes you think that the NCAA can afford it?”. I was simply providing some information that establishes they can afford it. Obviously, just throwing money at a problem is rarely the answer, just look at the government; but, they can obviously beef up beyond the 55 people at the Eligibility Center without jeopardizing their finances. The NCAA crying about not having enough people to do the job is entirely their own fault and they should be ashamed of trying to get sympathy for how much they have to do. After all, they are the ones making the rules. Just like with the government, rules (laws) are made with no thought to the cost or method of enforcement.
As to your first answer to a problem being to spend more money or increase headcount, I never intimated that was my intent; although, when you look at the numbers in this situation (55 people reviewing 90,000 people) do you have a better first answer? It’s easy to say someone is wrong or you would never operate that way, especially when you don’t offer an alternative.
+1 hobo
The man himself uses the agrument that he doesn’t have enough people. SO GET THOSE PEOPLE! The simple fix for 99% of this problem is for the NBA to allow kids out of h.s. just like they did before. Or, like football, make the kids stay 3 yrs.
by bigbill992001 on Jun 4, 2010 7:52 PM EDT up reply actions
What most of the BBN wants
is a no-excuse approach to reviewing potential scholarship athletes. Is it that difficult for the NCAA to stand behind their pre-season review? If they review a potential athlete that ends up having violations after the season is completed, is that the fault of the school that awarded him the scholarship? They (the NCAA) should be held responsible for their own actions.
If I were to give you a counterfeit $50 bill that I received from a bank, who should you hold responsible, me or the bank?
Well, you are responsible for the counterfit bill actually.
If you try to use it at a store and are caught, you would likely be asked questions.
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Jun 4, 2010 4:20 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
exactly the point he is trying to make......
he would have to prove that he got that money from the bank
I AM THE CAT......The Cat In The Hat!!!
You would not be thrown in jail though, unless they thought you were behind making it or intentionally passing it.
In criminal law it is called mens rea. The state of mind matters.
Notice how the NCAA demands that a school give back its payout from the NCAA tourney when games are vacated? Yet, despite the now legal fiction that those games won by the punished school were never played (they aren’t forfeited – just vacated – didn’t happen), the NCAA doesn’t give money back to CBS which paid handsomely for putting the “non-game” on TV, nor does it refund the fans that bought tickets. In other words, the NCAA gets a pure windfall – it gets money back that was paid from revenue from TV contracts and ticket sales but doesn’t pass the money along up stream.
Nice deal if you can get. If the private business world, such a windfall scenario would likely suggest an incentive to find ways to force vacated games.
I got off on a tangent, but what I really think we need is a verification process that is reliable enough that the NCAA doesn’t punish innocent schools if it later finds out someone (other than the school) tricked the system.
JackBluto
You’re right. It is a wonderful deal. Reserved only for bureaucracies.
Big Dan Issel......The Best there is.
Actually the bank
should have investigated that $50 bill further before they gave me the permission to use it. And the bank better not vacate my $50 either.. ;-)
Cameron1
You’re right Cam. Except the NCAA is a bureaucracy because no one polices the organization but themselves. Just like the IRS.
Besides, I wasn’t aware that the NCAA was an investment organization. Where do all of
those PROFITS go?
Big Dan Issel......The Best there is.
Tru
I know that many of you think Tipton has it in for Kentucky, and I won’t try to change your mind about that. I know that some of you have it in for the NCAA, and I’m not trying to change you mind on that.
Are confessing to being a fence sitter? ;-)
Not at all.
I am on record, and still believe, that Tipton does a good job overall. He occasionally does some things I don’t agree with, but I am and always have been fine with him.
I take issue when I think he goes to far, but several people distrust, and even loath him to the point that they ask me to identify all Tipton liks so they can boycott them.
A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan
The NCAA makes $500 kazillion
off the basketball tournament and bowl games, but try as it might to stand for truth, justice and all that is right in the “pure as the driven snow” world of collegiate athletics:
…the initial ruling on a player’s eligibility can be preliminary in nature given that the NCAA’s Eligibility Center has less than 55 employees charged with judging whether about 90,000 incoming athletes each year can play for college teams.
That works out to over 1,600 each.
Not counting PF and his buddy from Syracuse. They only put about 5 or 6 on their plate.
-- Tim . http://HomeSalesLexington.com/barn
How many student athletes need a deep review?
Seriously – I bet the many country club sports don’t have to worry about this review process. Buffy, the college tennis player from Country Club High School probably earned her 3.7, and her Daddy probably did give her that small “starter” BMW. More than 20 minutes on those thousands of applications are a waste of resources.
Not all reviews are created equal.
The Tipton piece says ...
… that “hundreds” need an in-depth review.
A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan
I agree, JackBluto
.
I guess I just didn’t realize that passing through the NCAA’s very own Eligibility Center was pretty much the same as getting your hand stamped at the county fair so you can go back and get something you accidentally left in your car.
If EB’s rise in GPA is a ‘red flag’ in May of 2010, it was the same color back when he was being recruited. If the NCAA doesn’t care enough to look deeper into at that time, then why leave it up to PF and his Syracuse buddy to bring it up a year later?
How many kids are slipping through the cracks that they never hear about because PF isn’t on the beat? Does the NCAA even care?
-- Tim . http://HomeSalesLexington.com/barn
Tru
Thanks again for a good article.
I really feel sorry for the NCAA EC. Surely they are so poor that their kids are “eating the
putty off the windows.” In fact it was reported once that the NCAA board of dictators
couldn’t even afford the “price of a free meal.” LOL
I think we should take up a love offering for these poor downtrodden folks. LOL
If I could work my will they would cease to exist. Replace the whole sytem. But that would be like Nero inviting the Christians to a feast for them instead of the lions.
Big Dan Issel......The Best there is.
You're welcome.
I know you are being sarcastic, but there is no reason to feel sorry for anyone.
I am not passing judgment on the sufficiency of the reviews. I am simply saying that the NCAA is being right when they suggest their review for most athletes is cursory. If they wanted to do a more in-depth review on more athletes, they could do so by merely hiring more bodies.
My assumption is that they are happy with the way the system works now, and any protestation of insufficiency is mostly crocodile tears.
A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan
Tru
Man. How did you know. I just collected a five gallon bucket. Going to water the garden with
them. Just jesting. LOL
Although the sarcasm was real, I guess I’m a little frustrated with it all. I remember the old days when kids walked a pretty straight path because most of them were taught to.
That’s what bugs me about this thing with Eric Bledsoe. I have never met him but his
deportment on the court leads me to believe that he is such a young man. My congrats go
to his parents for a job well done.
Big Dan Issel......The Best there is.
Guys - Don't get caught up in this issue of the NCAA Eligibility Center's reliability.
Only an incompetent would not independently investigate the issues surrounding a recruitment not only seeking verification of NCAA assurances of eligibility but also examining a plethora of separate issues about an athlete concerning his suitability to receive a scholarship offer. Not to is analogous to a preschool taking the position that the fact a job applicant isn’t in jail is an endorsement by public officials of the applicants suitability and sufficient rational for hiring.
There may be 90,000 cases annually handled by the NCAA but there are a total of only a couple of hundred recruits of interest from all Kentucky teams. A nuanced triage winnowing through successive layers of meticulous focus by coaches, administrators and outside investigators is more than reasonable, it’s essential.
I have been told such a thorough examination does take place at Kentucky coordinated through the AD’s office. The elements of such investigations are not talked about with outsiders if for no other reason than the extreme sensitivity of some of the findings but some files are reputed to be pretty thick.
Big schools generally get into trouble when this in-house investigation fails to turn up something that later emerges or failing to check with the NCAA regarding eligibility issues that were discovered either through negligence or a misplaced confidence – not from their actual reliance on the NCAA Eligibility Center. When Memphis and now Kentucky hold up the fact the NCAA verified their recruit’s eligibility, they are just engaging in the common defense of shifting focus, and thereby blame, from their own investigation and any potential inadequacies or attendant decisions.
I’m confident Kentucky knew about all the issues pending in this current controversy and potentially a bunch of other stuff that was examined and found them all to be no impediment to offering Eric a scholarship in the opinion of those who examined them. The real question is – were they correct?
Good for you.
Another voice of reason. Good luck to you.
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Jun 4, 2010 4:23 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
HozeKing -
I’ve come to understand why you are one of Tru’s truly prized posters. I don’t always agree with your positions but I certainly welcome your participation.
Team
I’ve heard Hoze called many things!“A truly prized poster” hardly fits the bill.
Happy Days are here again! Wildcat's have #1 recruiting class again!
oldcat70 -
As much controversy as HozeKing stirs here with his positions, tenacity and attitude, if Tru didn’t love him like a brother (and probably for just those reasons) then he would have been gone long ago. Think about it.
Team
His positions,tenacity and attitude are the very reasons he should be posting on other boards!
Happy Days are here again! Wildcat's have #1 recruiting class again!
What makes you think I don't?
Besides, I like following UK basketball. Maybe I’ve come to love the ‘Embrace the Hate’ philosophy. It’s a great thing, right?
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Jun 4, 2010 6:09 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Because your profile indicates you're a member of 2 SB sites,
and you’ve only commented on the UofL blog a few times, and this one thousands of times.
I just love it when people bring that up....
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Jun 4, 2010 7:23 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Good one!! Too funny!
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Jun 4, 2010 7:28 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Well unlike many, I try not to take myself so seriously. I suggest you give it a try.
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Jun 4, 2010 7:31 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Now, now boys.
Put up your cardboard swords and hug each other. Remember:
If you don’t___Embrace the hate
Then you will_Embrace the gate.————————LOL
Big Dan Issel......The Best there is.
"Love him like a brother?"
Heh.
In defense of Hoze, I don’t want this place to become an echo chamber. Hoze serves that purpose when he is at his best, as do others.
I hate an echo chamber, and I could have that by merely reacting to dissent like most sites do. Anyone willing to rationally attack my reasoning (not mischaracterize it and raise strawman after strawman as Hoze and others sometimes do) is always welcome.
Excessive negativism is not good for business, but good, reasoned debate is great for it, and you can’t have that if everyone agrees.
A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan
Tru,
this morning your posts have already assumed a more easy going, spread the love, “I’m at the beach!” tone. I guess we can surmise you’ve reached vacation nirvana. Enjoy.

kentuckywild
No way man. Our Tru? He’s drinking Mint Juleps. Oh, I forgot Myrtle
Beach is in South Carolina. No Mint Juleps there. LOL
Big Dan Issel......The Best there is.
Well thank you!
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Jun 4, 2010 6:04 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I would agree with you essentially.
Except for what UK knew about this current controversy. UK probably knew all it needed to about the academic issue, and frankly I doubt there is a real issue there. It just isn’t that hard to get better grades (1) in correspondence classes (2) in classes retaken and (3) in high school level community college classes. Going from a 1.9 to a 2.5 when you consider 2 or 3 of his worst grades were removed in favor of the retaken class grades isn’t that remarkable. I’ve known law students who did similar feats in college by retaking the class that blemished their record in order to raise the GPA to law school level.
What UK probably did not know about is the cash to Momma allegations. I don’t think there is any reason for UK to interview Bledsoe’s landlord during the recruiting process.
Maybe.
But how do you cram in that extra course work in a limited amount of time? In college, that typically extends out to an extra term or two. Hmmmmm….
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Jun 4, 2010 6:00 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
dude i took extra classes in school
and played basketball and i knew i wasnt making millions oh and i wasnt dirt poor… heck my gpa my first 2 years were horrible because i was just being a clown but taking correspondence courses during lunch and after school raised my gpa up alot.. i think bledsoe also took online classes at his leisure.. people making a big thing over nothing.. and i know richard pitino and donavon tried to land bledsoe untill he commited… hmmm i wonder if richard pitino was unnamed source who was so-called ask to pay bledsoe’s hs coach…lol..hmmmmm
Jack
No – Coaches always check the living arrangements of recruits. Along with inconsistent clothes, cars and jewelry that is the most likely place an improper gift/inducement will be found. Remember, there had already been a controversy with the AHSAA over Eric’s relocation to the Parker district and the family had a history of eviction that even resulted in them living in a car for a time.
The item where the college coach alleges he was pressed for a ‘recruiting fee’ is the one I think has a chance to have gone undetected until the post hoc media investigation. But even that depends on how much back channel communication goes on between college recruiters. Some schools had already backed off Eric by the time Kentucky got involved, ostensibly the claim is they felt his grades would not allow him to qualify but you never know.
TW, according to the NYT, the rent was $400/month.
They don’t make sh*tholes cheaper than that in cities, even Birmingham, Alabama. What was inconsistent?
For a family living in a car a few month earlier...
anything with indoor plumbing
I'm sorry, but..
I still do not see how this is even potentially fair. Correct me if I’m interpreting this wrong, but WHY should ANY athletic department have to base their decision of recruiting an athlete on “hope?”….because let’s face it, that’s all they’re really doing, right? “Hoping” this player’s credentials are what has been provided to them? “Hoping” they made the right decision on a player and expecting no repercussions from it down the road (e.g. after the season is complete)? Christ..maybe even “hoping” their recruit gets through the very first period of “extensive review” so that they don’t have to deal with this BS when it’s too late. It’s an honor system with a lot of flaws, in my opinion.
I’m sorry, but I think if a player is ruled eligible then they are ELIGIBLE. This whole “flag” garbage is…well, just that: garbage! I mean, hell, at least notify the university that the player is “flagged” ahead of time, or that allowing a certain athlete to participate might incur problems down the road. It’s ignorant, and really frustrates me as a fan (I know, I’m not the only one).
You dont always need to rely on 'hope'.
You can actually decide it’s not worth the risk and offer another, safer recruit a scholarship. You know, like a number of schools did with Bledsoe.
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Jun 4, 2010 6:03 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Of course not.
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Jun 4, 2010 6:57 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I don't quite remember Bledsoe's recruitment like you do.
I don’t remember schools backing off for fear of his grades. I remember everyone that thought they had a chance getting involved and dropping out when it was apparent that they were not in the running.
+1 to pinata
does anyone else have a prob when they try to make a reply, that reply goes where they didn’t intend it? It looks likie my 1st ‘+1’ is for HK
by bigbill992001 on Jun 4, 2010 8:07 PM EDT up reply actions
pinata89 - Yes and No ...
Yes, in that you may “Investigate all you want, but the connections are so vast, so interwoven, and so fluid that it’s impossible to ensure that nothing in a prospect’s past will bubble up to the surface, unless it was a prospect whose circumstances make him invulnerable to these influences. But, an invulnerable prospect does not exist. Even wealthy suburban kids can get noticed by agents, runners, financial advisors, and trainers.” – Compliance Guy. So, yes, indeed, in the end, hoping is what you are left with. There are darn few guarantees in life.
No, in that risk can be minimized by prudent thorough due diligence. In fact, as stated by John Shukie, a lot of times the affected college gets involved as “a conduit, getting information from the high school, tracking down information from the student-athlete.” The school maximizes the chance they themselves are getting a complete and accurate picture by making sure the NCAA gets all its questions answered. But in addition to the good will such a hand-in-glove relationship develops with the NCAA, it also provides a rationale to the recruit for the other more or less intrusive components of a school’s investigation that are just as important in assessing the suitability of a prospect not handled by the Eligibility Center or over which the NCAA has no interest or jurisdiction. Bottomline, while you can’t eliminate all risk, you can substantially reduce it to the point member institutions can effectively operate.
Finally, I’m not sure what the deal is with school notification when a red flag is raised. While it makes sense to want a school to be notified the prospects privacy rights might be jeopardized or culpable individuals at the university might be tipped to an investigation thereby jeopardizing evidence. I’ll see if I can’t find out.
RUMOR TIME!
I go to law school with a girl whose brother works in the Cavaliers front office (I know, I sound like Forty – all due respect to him)…he told her that Danny Ferry (GM for past 5 years) was forced to resign today because he was not going along with owner Dan Gilbert’s plans to offer Cal $10-$12 million per year to be coach AND GM.
So sorry, 1 that I posted this, and 2 if it’s already been discussed.
They're going to "quietly" offer him the job this weekend, apparently.
I sent her this —> http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=5251953
And she said ESPN, in normal fashion, will take it down when it leaks that they’ve offered the job.
umm cal gave espn a quote a few hours after your post
CALIPARI WILL BE AT UK NEXT YEAR … THE NBA HAS HAD AN EPIC FAIL…LOL…CALS QUOTE " IM HAVE THE BEST COACHING JOB IN THE US"
im have...lol my school changed my grades
but seriously calipari has again stated that he will be at uk next year and he and lebron haven’t talked about him coaching him and that he isnt part of any package deal to land lebron … how many times does calipari have to say he will be at uk next year… jeez
How many times did Saban and Petrino say it before?
Calipari also said he wasn’t leaving Memphis. I LOVE Cal, but when you have the best you have to realize that he will be sought after, and might be lured away.
What job you think is better than UK? Seriously, the NBA is were you go as a coach to become ofscure, not Cal.
I totally agree.
The rumor I reported doesn’t indicate he is going to take the job, just that he’ll be offered the job.
I never said I thinkany NBA job is better than UK. Who knows what Cal thinks? They talk on the shows like PTI about how Cal’s book says he wants to return to the NBA eventually.
I’m also not saying anything will happen…I’m just saying that I wouldn’t be surprised if it eventually does.
by mrmondaynite on Jun 5, 2010 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions
I read his book, and never found him to say he wanted to go back to the NBA.
I wonder where the perception that the NBA is the “pinnacle” of coaching ever began. The greatest coaches in my estimation have(had) never coached in the NBA. I chuckle when I read that college coaches “aspire” to coach in the NBA. I’d like to know if there has ever been a survey asking college coaches would they like to coach in the NBA during their career what the results would be.
first off saban and petrino leaving means...
nothing about calipari leaving.. second please post a link or a quote where calipari said he wasnt leaving memphis… i believe when he was asked about leaving memphis. he never once stated as he has done numerous times at uk that he will be at uk next year. i tend to believe any coach who is that adamant about his place next year. but i understand why you are commenting on it, after all it is a rumor but the man has said to the fans, espn, the school, and the rest of college basketball that he will be at uk next year. yes there is always a small chance any coach would leave but how many times must calipari shoot down the rumor before it stops… dang rumor is like the phoenix rising after dying
i wish calipari could get the
coach k and pitino treatment they say they are not leaving and the rumors stop calipari say it numerous times and its like talking to a brick wall, and its not like pitino doesn’t have a history of bolting on teams
To get the "Coach K" treatment, you need to remain at 1 school for 30+ years,
like Coach K has.
by mrmondaynite on Jun 5, 2010 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions
yea but last few years coach k
has flirted with the nba more times then pitino with women in italian restaurants…lol… no i get what you are saying man but when a coach repeatedly says that we shouldn’t believe the rumors and he will return, unless that guy is saban or petrino then we should believe him… and yea about the job offer, i heard the nets bulls and cavs all wants him
Not the Bulls...they offered the job to the Celtics' assistant.
Nets already had him years ago and he sucked.
K never "flirted"...he got offered jobs.
It was a unilateral affair…the NBA was seeking him, not vice versa.
oh i know the nba wanted k but
coach k got his nba fix coaching usa teams, thats what i meant by flirting,, rumors ran rampid when he coached the usa teams, and about calipari and the bulls and nets… the bulls realized he is coming back to uk, funny they make the hire after calipari restates he isnt leaving uk and lebron and him are not a package deal, and the nets offered pitino, coach k and calipari the job… but that is what espn sources were saying… none of the job offers were actually proven.. but most teams deny offers when they get turned down.. but we will see.. i know these calipari leaving uk rumors wouldn’t be started had nba teams not sent out feelers
The rumor I reported above is NOT that Cal is leaving.
The rumor above is that he’ll be offered the Cleveland job.
by mrmondaynite on Jun 5, 2010 10:22 AM EDT up reply actions
Interesting
but if I was in Danny Ferry’s shoes (as GM) I’d even object to Elmer Fudd being offered the coach and GM job for 2 bucks an hour. In either case, Ferry would be out of a job.
He said, she said.
Get out the sticks boys. It’s poop stirring time again! Oh yea. Check the punch the bowl
before filling your cup.
Big Dan Issel......The Best there is.
Kudos for the early scoop.
Ferry is out the door according to this. One interesting quote from Ferry was:
It’s important that whomever is hired as the head coach knows and understands the people he is going to work with.
Even with that I’d put the Cal chances at 1 in a million. Especially with the owner, Dan Gilbert saying that he will hire a defensive-oriented coach. Cal is rated exceptional in several areas but his defensive prowess isn’t the first that comes to mind.
Somebody may have already said this....
I don’t have time to read all the comments in this thread but I feel that if you are a coach recruiting a player with a history of bad grades and suddenly in his senior year he makes a dramatic improvement maybe you should be concerned and shy away from that player..
And as far as Cal and the NBA,this is just another fly in the ointment as to why he may bolt if this thing with Bledsoe gets messy,which I believe it will .

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