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Rick Pitino Admits to Affair With Sypher

Oh, dear.

More photos » Michael Conroy - AP

Oh, dear.

WAVE 3 and WHAS 11 are reporting that current Louisville and former Kentucky coach Rick Pitino admitted a sexual liaison with Karen Sypher.  He also, according to the report, admitted giving Sypher $3,000 to pay for an abortion to pay for health insurance [Note:  After reading the police report, I feel compelled to correct this, as it is quite important.  The original news reports got this detail somewhat wrong.  Read the report at the link above].

There are no other real details in the WAVE report, other than a very contrite and upset Rick Pitino apparently answering some questions in a news conference.

More on this as details become available.

[Update]

Well, I have read more about this breaking story, and I want to hearken back to this post I made earlier, for which I received a considerable amount of heat.  I hate to say "I told you so," but the bizarre media silence about this seemingly straightforward, if embarrassing, fact is utterly beyond the pale. 

Even though Sypher has allegedly done lawlessness for which, if she is guilty, she should certainly pay, the earlier attempts by Pitino and those surrounding him to paint her as some kind of a psychopath in order to keep this matter out of the press strikes me as very, very wrong.  To wit:

"My family and I were recently threatened as part of a criminal scheme to extort money.  Upon receiving these threats, we reported this extortion attempt to the FBI.  While I did not want to make this matter public, I recently learned that the individual behind this extortion attempt has already gone to the media with false, defamatory and outrageous allegations in an attempt to pressure me to cave in to this scheme.  I intend to vigorously defend my reputation and the character of my family against any criminal scheme to extort money."

I can't say for sure what Pitino was referring to as "false and defamatory," but my impression is that this statement was misleading.  The news report said something about an allegation by Sypher of rape, and that could certainly be what he was referring to, and given the facts we know, I would have to agree.  But clearly, this statement gives the unquestionably intentional impression that all of Sypher's information was "false and defamatory."  We now know that isn't so.

And I cannot for the life of me figure out why it took so long for this to be confirmed.  It's almost as if nobody in the print or broadcast media really wanted to find out the details of this story, and that both baffles and disturbs me. 

I don't have the heart to condemn Rick Pitino for his liaison because I have good friends who have had affairs, and I don't condemn them.  Yes, their actions and coach Pitino's actions were unethical and wrong.  But worse for Pitino is the difficulty he must have had reconciling his payment to terminate Sypher's apparent pregnancy with his Catholic faith [Please see the note above regarding the police report.  Initial reports had this part incorrect.  Pitino gave her the money apparently with the understanding that it would pay for health insurance after she told him she was going to have an abortion but didn't have health insurance].  I am very sorry for our former coach, and hope that he can find a way through, because unless I miss my guess, he is going through Hell right now, and he has only just begun his journey.  I hope he can find his way back out the other side, and long before the Devil knows he's there.

This says nothing whatever about Pitino's ability as a coach, although he definitely has some explaining to do to his young charges.  These are the kinds of personal actions that cannot be written off by a man in Pitino's position as a "personal matter" -- he is in charge of young men's lives, they look to him for guidance not just in basketball but in life, and he must find a way to turn this negative into a positive with respect to the young men under his care.  Handling this the right way, being up front and honest about it, is something he should have done months ago, but now absolutely must do now in order to begin the recovery process from this unfortunate indiscretion.

In the end, this is a body blow to the personal repuation of a sure Hall of Fame coach.  Rick Pitino is a big part of Kentucky's legacy, and I will love him forever for his years as a Wildcat, even as I must consider him the opposition as coach of the Cardinals.  I hope that he can summon up his formidable will and raise himself back up from this knockdown. 

I was not happy to hear this news, and my heart is heavy.

2 recs  |  Comment 177 comments |

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WOW

First time I shot her, shot her in the side.
Hard to watch her suffer, but with the second shot she died...

by btcoop71 on Aug 11, 2009 11:16 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I guess we all were working on the same story here....

not good folks. This is not a good thing.

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 11, 2009 11:32 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

No.

It is not. I am very sad.

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 11, 2009 11:51 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Frankly I'm surprised it took so long for

the public records request to be utilized. Disparaging or not, this is news. Secondly, the link in this article points out a very important clause in Pitino’s contract which makes me think the rumor mill about him being fired is set to begin in T minus three, two, one…

by BlueInNash on Aug 11, 2009 11:54 PM EDT via mobile reply actions   0 recs

What link?

I didn’t see anything about his contract in anything I read. Maybe I missed it.

Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."

by chirop1 on Aug 12, 2009 7:40 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

It's in the WHAS link at the beginning of this blog post

about halfway through the article. Probably a clause that exists in every coach’s contract, but doesn’t become relevant until you have a situation like this.

by BlueInNash on Aug 12, 2009 7:52 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

Ah... missed that somehow.
WHAS11’s Sports Director Kyle Draper reports there is a stipulation in Rick Pitino’s contract which gives the university the right to fire him for just cause, and that one clause in particular sticks out. It says just cause shall be understood to include all of the following:

"Disparaging media publicity of a material nature that damages the good name and reputation of employer or university, if such publicity is caused by employee’s willful misconduct that could objectively be anticipated to bring employee into public disrepute or scandal, or which tends to greatly offend the public, or any class thereof on the basis of invidious distinction."

Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."

by chirop1 on Aug 12, 2009 8:16 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

As I have said before, my heroes are dwindling in number.

This may be something that he cannot get past with big time recruits that have close knit families with traditional values. I was really hoping this was not true.

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 11, 2009 11:55 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Pitino - Sypher

Based on the C-J’s Andrew Wolfson, in an article Wild Weasel linked and I put on the front page just below Tru’s post — The only part of this tale that seems odd to me is the presence of Pitino’s assistant, some fellow named Abbott.

It seems he was in the restaraunt unbeknownst to either Pitino or Sypher and overheard what he thought were two people, uh, enjoying themselves. He says he lied down, as if to hide. This to me reads like a convoluted (and unnecessary) confirmation from a witness that a rape did not occur.

Pitino supposedly had the keys to the place, so how did Abbott get out of the eatery? Well, he could have left during the interlude, but he couldn’t have locked the door as he “fled the scene” because he didn’t have a key.

That whole (Abbott) thing doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. But, I do not for one second think Pitino raped Sypher. He used abysmal judgment, sure, but rape? No way. But when one has a marriage that allows for such daliances, this is the price that is sometimes to be paid.

by Ken Howlett on Aug 11, 2009 11:56 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

And quite frankly

this incident supports a lot of the “talk” I’ve heard about Pitino for nearly 20 years now.

by Ken Howlett on Aug 11, 2009 11:59 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ken, Abbott was not an assistant

Sgt. Andy Abbott said in an investigative summary that Sypher failed, for example, to disclose that another person was at Porcini Restaurant when she said the first incident occurred.

That witness, Vinny Tatum, an executive assistant to Pitino, told the FBI that he didn’t see what happened but heard "only the sounds of two people that seemed to be enjoying themselves during a sexual encounter," according to Abbott’s report.

Per the CJ article.

by kykat51 on Aug 12, 2009 12:41 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Abbott? Where did I get that from?

I obviously meant Tatum.

Thanks for correcting the mistake.

by Ken Howlett on Aug 12, 2009 1:07 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Truzen, very well written article and I concur.

As angry as I still am with Pitino for going to Louisville, my heart is still heavy.

by UKTimmy on Aug 12, 2009 12:01 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Well said.

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 12, 2009 12:16 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

nicely done

rec’d

GO BIG BLUE!! GO BIG BLUE!!

by UKWildCatFanatic on Aug 12, 2009 12:21 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I feel for the many Cardinal fans I call friends

They were proud of Rick’s stature and character. Both are taking a hit right now big time. I wonder how my sister will share this with my young nephew who idolizes Pitino and the Cards right behind Peyton and the Colts. Though I liked to disrespect “traitor Rick” any chance I got (for fun to get a rise out of my nephew and his dad lol) — I am saddened. Maybe Barkley is right. Maybe not. Go Peyton.

No matter where you're at, there you are

by cincyblue on Aug 12, 2009 12:52 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Wow, I didn't even think about this...

And I have two little girls.

If it was just an affair I think it would just be another story (maybe a big story locally), but I know that the other element of this takes it to the next level. Now its moved beyond the sports page and is on national news sites. Its so public now for all to see. Its almost painful to read it. It just is.

I’m sure a lot of parents are going to have to answer a lot of tough questions from young sports fans (Cards and Cats).

by scfcats on Aug 12, 2009 2:50 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Beyond sports...

This is ugly and sad. I’m just not sure what to say.

Great right up and I’m really impressed with what everyone is saying here.

I’m more than a little worried about UK v UL at Rupp. If Pitino walks in I hope we can stay classy, may be a long shot though.

by scfcats on Aug 12, 2009 2:39 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Spitino gone

I see him gone by early October. Commits won’t leave and time to find temp successor. I don’t feel bad for ol boy, he knew what he was doing. I feel bad for Mr Sypher cause he stood by his boss who deceived him as well as his wife. What an ultramaroon!

What I am upset about was the chance to see Spitino n Calimari duke it out. Maybe I’ll be wrong.

I LOVE COOKING WITH WINE
Sometimes I even put it in the food.

by bluecrip on Aug 12, 2009 6:58 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I really don't know.

It could be that Pitino will decide that he can no longer effectively serve U of L with all the stuff surrounding this affair. I don’t see U of L firing him, but I do think that a conversation will (and possibly already has) take place about whether or not this will be such a distraction that he can’t do his job.

There is also the personal angle to this. I don’t know how long Joanne and his kids have known about this debacle (it really casts into question the leaving of Richard now), but his marriage could collapse at any time, and that could render him unable to do his job. I truly hope that he has been mending these fences in the interregnum, but I really don’t know.

I would feel robbed by fate if we had to forgo the Calipari/Pitino wars, but given what Pitino has to deal with, it looks like a real possibility.

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 12, 2009 7:32 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree

I think it is better than 50-50 that Pitino quits.

First time I shot her, shot her in the side.
Hard to watch her suffer, but with the second shot she died...

by btcoop71 on Aug 12, 2009 7:34 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Honestly

I loved him when he was at UK, and I still respected him at UL. Now? He is beneath my contempt. Maybe it is my pro life bias swaying me (Lord, lets not start that debate), but his actions in this case make me want to vomit.

First time I shot her, shot her in the side.
Hard to watch her suffer, but with the second shot she died...

by btcoop71 on Aug 12, 2009 7:33 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I don't want to go into hot-button social issues.

The matter of his Catholic faith and the ultimate circumstances are going to disturb many, and respect for him will take a serious, hit. It is problematic, if you will forgive the quintessential understatement.

My take is that people are imperfect and flawed, and do wrong things. What Rick Pitino did was a betrayal of his faith and a betrayal of his family. How painful must it be to be Rick Pitino today? In an incredibly ironic twist, he even winds up owing Karen Sypher, a woman who apparently tried to extort millions from him, an apology for his behavior. The list of “I’m sorry’s” he is in for is truly long and broad, starting with God Himself and going all the way down to a likely felon.

I can muster nothing but sadness, regret … even pity for the damage he has done to his life, his reputation and his family. I truly feel for Joanne and the kids — what they must be or have gone through is just … more embarrassment than a human being should ever have to bear.

I just pray that there is enough forgiveness to go around, at least among those who count the most to him. What we as fans feel must sting a little, but really, that doesn’t matter. But his family, friends and close associates — that matters, and I have no doubt that most of them are very put out with Rick Pitino today. But I hope they will forgive him.

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 12, 2009 8:06 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

You know something though Tru,

THIS is a hot-button social issue. Just as much as the underlying abortion, abuse of family trust, adultery and the like. These situations are becoming way too commonplace in the world of sports and celebrity. I am sorry to sound like a man on a soapbox, but a person DOES open themselves up to scrutiny when they put themselves in a position of public life. Morals and values are a big part of what Coach Pitino and all of the others of his profession are supposed to be teaching these young men who in anywhere from 1-4 years after they sign up with him, sign for millions of dollars to play pro, to sell sports drinks, cures for body aches and the like. If the Coach cannot control his own life, how does he teach them to control theirs?

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 12, 2009 8:33 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I could not agree more.

What I was saying is that I don’t want to debate Roe v. Wade here, or the ethis

But you are right that it is a hot-button issue along with all the others you mentioned.

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 12, 2009 9:14 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I come off sounding really holier than thou sometimes if I dont watch myself.....

didnt mean to do that, but somewhere, somehow, someone has to start adressing these moral issues so that these kids coming up have some guidelines for what is expected of them in society.

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 12, 2009 9:17 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hot button social issues

I dont think you can escape the issues regarding this situation. While I agree the entire incident is very unfortunate and sad I dont see how you can feel sorry for the man. He brought this on himself. Im decidedly pro life and the abortion angers me much more than the affair does. Feeling sorry for his family however is another matter.

DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!

by davw83 on Aug 12, 2009 9:11 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Pitino

has plenty of resources to raise another child “if indeed Sypher was actually pregnant, it’s certainly unprovalbe and given the holes in her claims she may not have been at all” BUT if she was Pitino ended a life simply for the sake of expediency and to avoid emberassment.

DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!

by davw83 on Aug 12, 2009 9:13 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I didnt read the WHAS piece

Ther CJ story didnt have anything about an ultrasound though.

DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!

by davw83 on Aug 12, 2009 9:18 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

yeah, I went back and looked it up....third page of the piece

she was giving information to the cop about timeline and claimed that the second rape occurred about three days after the ultrasound, when Pitino was out of town. Made the cop believe that the whole story was unbelieveable. And I understand the holes in her story, and why they were so damaging to her credibility.

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 12, 2009 9:24 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah.

Two weeks is an awful short time to have a pregnancy show up on ultrasound.

I am suspicious of the claim Pitino got her pregnant.

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 12, 2009 9:18 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Not sure that it matters in the end

The fact is, he believed she was pregnant, and gave her money to “fix” it. So whether or not she was actually pregnant is irrelevant, as far as Pitino’s actions and culpability are concerned.

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 12, 2009 9:35 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Good point

DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!

by davw83 on Aug 12, 2009 10:02 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Indeed.

It matters not.

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 12, 2009 10:14 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

You are right, I am sad for all parties involved

First time I shot her, shot her in the side.
Hard to watch her suffer, but with the second shot she died...

by btcoop71 on Aug 12, 2009 10:00 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I do know this much,

this puts her comments about what happened in a whole new light. We all defended Pitino to a certain extent when we had no credible proof that the incident ever happened. Now, this is simply a case of he said-she said, and those are never, well, simple.

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 12, 2009 7:50 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I dunno who was defending him...

Most of us saw this story about WDRB editing out a picture of Sypher’s son holding a sign referencing an abortion. I think we all acknowledged that the likelihood of a sexual relationship was a distinct possibility, and that an abortion wasn’t out of the realm of possibility.

I think most around here thought it was odd that the local news hadn’t broken the details of the story earlier and that we agreed that Pitino likely did nothing illegal.

In the end, that’s where we stand. No laws broken by Pitino, but a lot of bad PR.

Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."

by chirop1 on Aug 12, 2009 8:32 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Let me rephrase, we all took a cautious approach to the story

a “wait and see” approach so as not to jump to any conclusions and gave him the benefit of the doubt where his behavior was concerned. Now, my questions are just as heavily pointed at him as they are at her. as I said in another post, maybe there is some truth to what she is saying?? I will not go so far as to say that I believe the man is guilty of criminal conduct yet, but I will say that it is now a much more believeable possibility than it was for me before this was released.

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 12, 2009 8:37 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Febuk's problems with the truth

Truzenzuzex’s candid comments are commendable.

Everyone understands febuk is a talented college basketball coach. That record speaks for itself.

The other part of febuk’s record also speaks for itself. He is a fundamentally dishonest sycophant. He was dishonest when he got into trouble with the NCAA as a young assistant coach. He was dishonest when he promised Michael Bradley’s family, and publicly assured UK fans, that he would stay at UK in the late 1990s (he already knew he would not). He was dishionest when he cheated on his wife Joan. And he has been shamelessly dishonest throughout the Sypher ordeal until finally forced this week to come clean.

All of this may make febuk a good fit with Jurich at UL. That is debatable, and ultimately for Jurich to address. But lies have consequences. In this case, Karen Sypher’s life has been seriously damaged or destroyed, and Heaven only knows how many other lives have been dragged into this to their ultimate detriment. I won’t argue for a minute that Sypher herself isn’t also at fault. Obviously she is responsible for her actions, and suffering the consequences. Having an affair is a lie, but isn’t illegal. Has this woman committed extortion….or is febuk willing to destroy another person by using influence and lies to cover for other lies he has already committed? The courts will decide, but it doesn’t take a genius to see what has really happened here. What a mess this liar has made of his life and many others.

My hope is that people will finally see through febuk now. I don’t know if febuk has the constitutional courage to stick it out at UL. His past history suggests he will cut and run, but this remains to be seen. The important thing is that parents of athletes need to wise-up and stop sending their sons to learn at this liar’s knee.

I hope no one will respond to this by suggesting all college basketball coaches are like febuk. I know some are, but it is the parents’ responsibility to do their due diligence and steer their sons in a better direction.

by Messenger on Aug 12, 2009 8:20 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I know I am going to regret asking this, but Febuk??

I assume this is an acronym??

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 12, 2009 8:27 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

febuk

febuk = formerly employed by UK

by Messenger on Aug 12, 2009 10:51 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Pitino will be gone

Either of his own accord, or not. One can be a rumored philanderer, but I’m sure whatever “agreement” he and his wife might have reached did not include this level of public embarrassment. Wouldn’t he at the very least least take a long “leave of absence” to fix his personal life? Even for appearances sake, if they have already worked through it?

But to me, the most damning quote is this, from UL President James Ramsey:

"Several months ago Coach Pitino informed me about the alleged extortion attempt. I’ve now been informed that there may be other details which, if true, I find surprising. My thoughts are with Coach Pitino and his family."

Clearly Ramsey did not know (or is at least positioning that he did not know). That’s a problem, no matter what Jurich might have known.

Combine the facts that Willard is there (providing a ready-made interim coach), Pitino is no longer a spring chicken and does not “need” the money, and I say he is out within a week.

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 12, 2009 8:58 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I think he rides it out

Its hot right now both locally and nationally, but if he can hunker down and have a decent season, it will all fade into obscurity.

Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."

by chirop1 on Aug 12, 2009 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Supposedly the big grief for him right now is with his

Catholic powerbase in Lexington, as far as doing his job is concerned. Now I do not profess to knowing my Catholicism extremely well, but I am assuming that he gets absolved of this by his priest and that will help him in resolving these issues with them. I say its a coin flip at this point as to if he stays or not.

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 12, 2009 10:03 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Absolved by the priest

I don’t know if that will help him in any meaningful PR way. I would think that if you managed to get him in front of a camera, the best you could get out of him is a reaffirmation that the Catholic Church is strongly opposed to abortion and that matters of personal faith are confidential.

Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."

by chirop1 on Aug 12, 2009 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Spitballin' here, but. . .

. . . if you take Ramsey’s statement at face value, it reads to me that they (Pitino and he) had a conversation about it in which Pitino presented his side, but that conversation didn’t appear to reveal that a) there was an abortion, and b) Pitino paid for it (the “other details” to which Ramsey refers).

Yet at the same time, you have Jurich saying: "Coach Pitino has been truthful with us about this matter all along. . . " So what happened here? Did he tell Jurich, but neither of them told Ramsey? Or taken further, did they both lie to Ramsey?

That’s where I think Pitino (and Jurich, quite frankly) has a problem. Authority figures do not like to be blindsided by this type of information, especially if the principal involved has had a hand in that deception (see also: Goodell’s reaction when he found out Vick had lied to him).

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 12, 2009 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Im not sure about him leaving

He doesnt seem the type of guy who is going to let something drive him away from his job unless it interferes with his effectivness.

DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!

by davw83 on Aug 12, 2009 9:20 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

This may not affect his effectiveness as a coach...

but the Universify will probably see this affecting his ability to draw in recruits, money from high power donors and the sympathy vote. I would say all three will see a hit in the coming weeks.

by BlueInNash on Aug 12, 2009 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Will it?

I don’t mean to be cynical here, but I don’t know that it will affect the university in the long run more than replacing Pitino with (for example) Ralph Willard would.

I think letting Pitino go would be a prime example of a short term gain and a long term loss. I feel the same way for Pitino choosing to leave of his own accord.

Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."

by chirop1 on Aug 12, 2009 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The Louisville boards are saying that Willard IS NOT the answer to the

What if? question. In fact there are supposedly some big name boosters adamantly against it. Story is that they would back Pitino staying and weathering the storm before they would back replacing him with Willard.

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 12, 2009 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Willard

By all accounts a nice guy, and he did well at WKU… but he’s had his chance to swim with the big fish in the Big East and he drowned.

I cringe everytime 40yearcatfan brings up that Pitino lobbied for Willard to be his replacement at UK.

Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."

by chirop1 on Aug 12, 2009 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I really don't know about that

Febuk’s track record shows a pattern of leaving a job when things get too good or too bad. Based on his performance history, he has already been in Louisville about as long as he ever stays anywhere. His son bolted Louisville to go to Gainesville as soon as the Sypher matter hit the fan, and this looks like a good time to get out of Dodge. This hurts his career options to a certain extent, but he still has alternatives. I think he may try to weather the storm for another season, but I will frankly be surprised if febuk is at UL a year from now. I agree with a comment I saw somewhere above that the relatively sudden arrival of Ralph Willard looks a lot like an attempt to put an interim coach option in place.

by Messenger on Aug 12, 2009 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Febuk

Is this something like “He who must not be named” or is there another reason you wont use the word Pitino?

DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!

by davw83 on Aug 12, 2009 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Now what, Rick?

He has known for a while that he made some very wrong decisions. He has known that all actions have consequences, good and bad. He has known that he has hurt most those around him who supported him without fail. I hope he realizes that those are the ones who really matter. Those are the ones who need to be reassured that they matter.
I am a firm believer that actions speak louder than words, and he can SHOW them they are important to him. Fans and recruits and such, (maybe), will be lead by the receptions of those closest to him. I really feel sorry for his family and close friends at this time. I hope it works out well for those few. As for the rest, only time will tell….

Blue... there is no other color to Bleed !!!

by a2d2 on Aug 12, 2009 10:59 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

So where is Hoze now?

First time I shot her, shot her in the side.
Hard to watch her suffer, but with the second shot she died...

by btcoop71 on Aug 12, 2009 1:27 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

He can save his job with a public apology -- maybe

and I mean an APOLOGY — heartfelt and honest. It may too late, though. My friends and relatives back in the Commonwealth say he must go… which surprised me a bit. I am willing to forgive as we are all sinners. But forgiveness comes from a contrite heart. If he doesn’t show that I think he’s toast.

No matter where you're at, there you are

by cincyblue on Aug 12, 2009 1:45 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I think most would accept that

not sure if UL or his family have, but I think the fans would. Media…no way on God’s Green Earth they let it slide with that

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 12, 2009 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The media will do what sells

I agree with you, the media might not accept an apology, especially if their feeding frenzy can sell papers, etc.. If this makes Entertainment Tonight I’m moving to another planet. By the way, I’ve started packing. lol

Maybe they somehow spin this as Pitino — the victim, though. Who knows. Sypher seems pretty shady.

No matter where you're at, there you are

by cincyblue on Aug 12, 2009 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I dont think UL fires him no matter what happen unless something new comes out

As of now he hasnt done anything illegal just morally bankrupt.

DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!

by davw83 on Aug 12, 2009 2:09 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yes, but Morally Bankrupt means something around these parts

We’ll have to wait and see ( I agree with your assessment) but Kentucky is full of conservative Christians of all faiths. That’s pretty much why I moved north of the river. I just didn’t fit in. lol

No matter where you're at, there you are

by cincyblue on Aug 12, 2009 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

He has a morality clause in his contract

just saying

First time I shot her, shot her in the side.
Hard to watch her suffer, but with the second shot she died...

by btcoop71 on Aug 12, 2009 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Here is a link

http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20090812/SPORTS02/908120382/Pitino%20contract%20contains%20morality%20clause

First time I shot her, shot her in the side.
Hard to watch her suffer, but with the second shot she died...

by btcoop71 on Aug 12, 2009 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I didnt say they wouldnt have cause to fire

I said I dont think they will. Im pretty confident he’s going to stick around for at least another season.

DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!

by davw83 on Aug 12, 2009 3:13 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

TSG has picked it up

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2009/0812093pitino1.html

First time I shot her, shot her in the side.
Hard to watch her suffer, but with the second shot she died...

by btcoop71 on Aug 12, 2009 2:36 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

ohhh man.....

making the smokinggun is not something anyone wants to see happen to anyone else…..I can picture lousy mugshots in my head…..and Pitino didnt even do anything illegal…..man

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 12, 2009 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

If he goes, he resigns

I’d put money on that. U of L will grant him that favor. If the morality clause kicks in and/or the media does not forgive him, he resigns. He may have been forced out, but he’ll resign, and we’ll never really know until his book comes out.

No matter where you're at, there you are

by cincyblue on Aug 12, 2009 2:50 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I can understand that....he has done a lot of good at Louisville

he has earned the right to resign, he might even gain some credibility if he resigned and said he was doing so due to the morality clause….take the high road and hope for the best….

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 12, 2009 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Tim Sypher

Is no one else noticing the oddity of Tim Sypher marrying Karen?

In time:
1. Rick Pitino has a sexual relationship with Karen Cunagin at Porcini on August 1, 2003.

2. Sometime mid- to late-August 2003, Mr. Pitino meets with Ms. Cunagin at the condo of his equipment manager, Tim Sypher, so that an alleged pregnancy can be discussed and payment of abortion money can be accomplished. Mr. Sypher and Ms. Cunagin meet for the first time.

3. In 2004, Mr. Sypher marries Ms. Cunagin (now Karen Sypher), the woman who may or may not have gotten knocked up by, but in any event, slept with and received abortion money from, his boss in a local restaurant less than one year prior.

Huh? Whaaaaaa? Any possibility this was a marriage of convenience or an “olive branch” to shut her up?

Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
--O.W.

by blbskue on Aug 12, 2009 3:00 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Now THAT is some sloppy seconds. . .

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 12, 2009 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

in all honesty it was less than 6 months later they married

I believe that the time line shows that the abortion and wedding are less than 5 months apart….

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 12, 2009 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Don't hold your breath waiting for some soul-baring apology

His attorney is now claiming that Pitino did not in fact pay for an abortion, rather just for some health insurance (and really, who can fault the man for finding it in the goodness of his heart to make sure this woman can get her yearly physical):

Pitino’s lawyer, Steve Pence, said Wednesday the coach believed the money was for insurance, not an abortion. Pence said Pitino asked Sypher how much the insurance would cost and she told him $3,000.

Of course, the appropriate response to this is a two-word phrase that Rich Brooks likes to use. But it sure doesn’t sound like a man about to throw himself on the mercy of the public. . .

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 12, 2009 3:02 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

That would be

back·ped·al (bkpdl)
intr.v. back·ped·aled or back·ped·alled, back·ped·al·ing or back·ped·al·ling, back·ped·als
1. To move the pedals of a bicycle or similar vehicle backward, especially to apply a brake.
2. To move backward by taking short quick steps, as in boxing or football.
3. To retreat or withdraw from a position or attitude: The senator later backpedaled on the issue.

First time I shot her, shot her in the side.
Hard to watch her suffer, but with the second shot she died...

by btcoop71 on Aug 12, 2009 3:05 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

So the police report is wrong?

Just askin’ .

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 12, 2009 3:37 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

And I have my answer.

According to the police report published on The Smoking Gun, she told him that she intended to have an abortion but she didn’t have health insurance. Pitino gave her the $3,000, ostensibly to pay for health insurance. Would she have had the abortion if he had not paid for her insurance? Only God would know that, and he’s not passing that information along to me.

Okay, I am not Catholic, so I don’t know how a Catholic would look at that. Does that get him off the hook since the money was not given directly to fund an abortion, but the health insurance that made it likely?

I think many, if not most, Protestants would say, “Not bloody likely.” But there is surely room for rationalization on that front.

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 12, 2009 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I can't believe you actually edited your post because of that

Whether or not he paid directly for an abortion, or so she could get health insurance to get an abortion*, is a distinction without a difference. To think that one would be condemned while the other would be okay is laughable. If it walks like a duck, talks like a duck. . .

*While we’re at it, is this even possible? Isn’t pregnancy the very definition of a “pre-existing condition” that would not be covered by getting insurance at that point? I’m not an insurance expert, so maybe someone can correct me (doesn’t Allblucat sell insurance or something?), but this seems wrong on its face.

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 12, 2009 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think it's important ...

… that we get the facts exactly right. I totally understand your point, but I think we should try to get the facts right first and foremost.

That’s just the way I see it. I do agree with your “distinction without a difference” comment 100%, though.

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 12, 2009 4:11 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I get your point about wanting everything correct, but. . .

. . . I still think the post should stand as written, since it focuses on Pitino giving money to achieve a certain outcome that may be in conflict with the teachings of his faith, and not on the mechanics of the transaction. Whether he gave the money to her to directly pay the doctor, or to give to her to pay an insurance company to pay the doctor, surely has no bearing on Pitino’s “moral guilt.” By that logic, if he had just handed the money to Tim Sypher and told him to hand it to her, would that have absolved him? Absolutely not.

Anyway, I still contend this version of events is impossible as it is a pre-existing condition.

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 12, 2009 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

You betcha....no way someone ( an insurance company) covers

a pre-existing condition like pregnancy unless you are enrolling in an already existing group plan during open enrollment. Just doesnt happen. But Tru brings another point to light by trying to get the facts straight. There are a LOT of things that DO NOT add up here. On BOTH sides.

1) She claims that Pitino raped her a second time when Pitino was verified to be out of town.
2) If all of this is correct that has been reported, this incident happened, she went to Pitino 2 weeks later and claimed pregnancy, and had tests to back it up. Her soon to be husband was at the meeting place when she arrived to get the funds provided to her by Pitino. Assuming the procedure could be scheduled ASAP, she gets the abortion, and she and Sypher are dating a couple of weeks later, and married within the next 5 months. Tell me this isnt a bad Dynasty rerun here.
3) Pitino’s assistant claims he was laying down and only “overheard” two people engaged in what he believed to be “consensual sex”. I would like to know what he qualifies as this, but in good taste, I’ll let that one slide.
4)She drives Pitino home, but is apparantly as inebriated as he was, and the designated driver stays behind?
5)This woman marries one of his friends, and then is in the middle of a divorce before any of this becomes public knowledge. Then it becomes an extortion case??
6)Pitino informs UL of what has happened, but the University president states that he was “surprised” by the information that became public in the article?
7)This “behavior” is supposedly allowed by Pitino’s spouse,and has allegedly happened before and since, yet, Pitino is not prepared for something like this to happen (which it ALWAYS does), and does not take care of making sure when the incident occurred that all “legalities” are not sewn up nice and neat? A man that negotiated contracts with professional basketball players for a living and was general manager of the Boston Celtics, does not have himself covered for this type of situation?
8)Pitino sent his son ( and no one will get me to believe otherwise) to Billy Donovan to get him out of town. If he were innocent of any legal wrongdoing, would he not want his family close to him in positions to help him deal with this and to be by his side as he faces what is sure to be monumental pressure?

I think Tru is right, we need to get all of the facts straight, I just wonder how many of the FACTS will be available for public scrutiny.

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 12, 2009 4:39 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Health Coverage

My understanding is pregnancy isnt a preexisting coverage that can be used to deny coverage. If someone is pregnant you cant deny them coverage for it.

DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!

by davw83 on Aug 12, 2009 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

In a group policy setting that is correct, in an individual policy it can be used to exclude

coverage for the pregnancy….not to deny coverage as a whole, but it would disallow any payment for services related to the condition, unless her life was threatened.

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 12, 2009 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

ASOB

the place to come if you need to know something

DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!

by davw83 on Aug 12, 2009 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Plus ANY pregnant woman

in Kentucky is automatically given FREE health insurance by the Commonwealth. It covers the entire pregnancy and the first six weeks (I believe) post partum.

by Thomas Hunt Morgan on Aug 12, 2009 5:44 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Overshadowed by the $3,000 health insurance payment...

….. Page 2 of that report also brings up another interesting issue. After already stating on Page 1 that he “had too much to drink and could not drive home”, and pointing out how much she had been drinking that evening, comes this from Pitino:

“He said that she had been picked up at a bar before coming to Porcini’s, then drank more once she arrived. He said that after she left, then returned, she drank even more. He did add that she did not seem too intoxicated to drive him home, that she was not weaving all over the road, or anything of that nature.”

Oh, man.

And all of this was in celebration of the hiring of Reggie Theus ?? (Page 1)

by Sonic on Aug 12, 2009 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Regie Theus

and by al account Theus wasnt even there to celebrate his own hire.

DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!

by davw83 on Aug 12, 2009 5:16 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's right!

Very good point…. :-)

I hope Theus is sorry for all the trouble he started….

by Sonic on Aug 12, 2009 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Tru's question on Pitino paying for insurance, not abortion.

Pitino funding her health insurance, but not the abortion directly absolutely does not absolve him. The Church teaches in her Catechism that

abortion willed either as an end or a means, is gravely contrary to the moral law

and that

A person who procures a completed abortion incurs excommunication latae sententiae,

that is automatically removed the Catholic Church. While Pitino has issues legally and athletically, his most serious issue is reconciling his actions with his faith and family.

by Thomas Hunt Morgan on Aug 12, 2009 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Informative.

And, it answers my question to boot! :-)

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 12, 2009 6:28 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Although to be fair

It does appear that she had decided on her own to abort, not that he talked her into it.

Does that change his culpability? If it were already a fait accompli, how great an obligation does he have to talk her out of it? Or is it in fact that he made the best decision in a bad situation – if she had already decided to abort, did he not have a duty to provide for medical care versus letting her go the proverbial back-alley-with-a-coat-hanger route?

I’m not sure I agree with that, but I’m curious. . .

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 12, 2009 6:37 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Good points.

I wrote above with the assumption of Tru’s original question: that Pitino provided money for health insurance with full understanding that money would be to procure an abortion.

your hypothetical add another layer to the ethical questions of the case, and I’m not suited to speak on those.

(And I’m not sure she was resolute on having on the abortion at the meeting in the condo. Pitino did say after all, that the baby would need paternity testing if born. Therefore, they must have at least broached the topic of bringing the pregnancy to term.)

by Thomas Hunt Morgan on Aug 12, 2009 6:51 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sanctimonious.

So I guess if he was Lutheran, it would have been okay. Call me a heathen, but you tread on shaky ground judging ones actions relative to one’s religion. Wow.

'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'

by HozeKing on Aug 12, 2009 6:54 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Please.

I’m giving my opinion as a Protestant, something I know about. I asked for the opinion of Catholics. How is that sanctimonious, Mr. Sanctimonious? :-)

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 12, 2009 6:58 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I just happen that it is fair game to judge one's character and moral decisions w/o bringing one's religion into play.

That makes you more sanctimonious. Look it up. Sanctimonious: making a hypocritical show of religious devotion, piety, righteousness, etc

Get it?

'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'

by HozeKing on Aug 12, 2009 7:04 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

So ...

… what you’re saying is that we have a difference of opinion. And based on that, you are accusing me of hypocrisy.

You’re just such a nice man. :-P

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 12, 2009 7:09 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

No.

I would have referenced your point as hypocritical. I didn’t. Hey, don’t let me stop you for being so judgemental. If you want to bring in religion…go to it.

'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'

by HozeKing on Aug 12, 2009 7:23 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Religion is an important part of Pitino's make-up (it appears)

So I think it’s a fair exercise to see how this is judged through that prism.

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 12, 2009 7:12 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

When does one religion cross the threshold of being 'important'?

Hmmmmm….just askin’.

'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'

by HozeKing on Aug 12, 2009 7:23 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think it's different for everyone

But Pitino made a point (as I remember from his time here, and anecdotally while he has been at Louisville – correct me if I’m wrong) of religion being an important part of his and his family’s (and his team’s) life (traveling chaplain, etc.). I don’t think he would deny that his religion is important to him. If it’s important to him, it’s a fair discussion topic.

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 12, 2009 7:31 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well isn't that a good thing then?

I find it sad that some find it fair game to use one’s religion against someone. In the Christian world I thought we were all sinners.

'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'

by HozeKing on Aug 12, 2009 7:39 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think we're talking past one another here

I agree with you that to batter someone in the name of that person’s religion (esp. if you are not of the same religion) is poor form – it’s a leap, at best.

But I think it’s perfectly valid to try to understand how Pitino views himself through the view of that religion. We are trying to understand the scope of the damage, as it were – the deed is done; the question is, how does Pitino feel about it? How will it impact him vis a vis his church, an important part of his life? I think those are valid topics, and what Tru was trying to get at.

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 12, 2009 7:48 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm a Lutheran

It is not ok.

next

First time I shot her, shot her in the side.
Hard to watch her suffer, but with the second shot she died...

by btcoop71 on Aug 12, 2009 10:10 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

A New Low

Of all the imbecilic comments you’ve made – and they are legion — , HozeKing, this one is particularly notable. Wise men from Zoroaster through Socrates to Huxley have recognized that religion in all its many forms is the basis of society’s moral structure. Thus to measure a person’s morals without considering their avowed religion is nonsense. Consider this from Longfellow:

Morality without religion is only a kind of dead reckoning — an endeavor to find our place on a cloudy sea by measuring the distance we have run, but without any observation of the heavenly bodies.

"The urge to save humanity is always a false front for the urge to rule it."

- H.L. Mencken

by Wild Weasel on Aug 13, 2009 8:46 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Very ...

… good point indeed. A moral compass that points in different directions depending on how the wind is blowing is not worth much. :-)

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 13, 2009 8:50 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

You need to be less insulting and more insightful.

I am not against religion. I am against getting into someone else’s religion. Wise up.

One’s own religion is after all a matter between oneself and one’s Maker and no one else’s.

Mohandas Gandhi

'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'

by HozeKing on Aug 13, 2009 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Dueling philosphers.

Hilarious. So who gets to say which is superior?

OK, I’ll dispose of this for you. Rick Pitino’s life is not lived in isolation. He is a very active Catholic, it is part of his support base. He has even had an audience with the Pope, and has a Catholic priest with him during his games. His dedication to his religion is hugely responsible for much of the respect accorded to him in this community. Therefore, it is entirely relevant for that context to be present when examining his actions.

Religion, in general, is not personal and never has been. That’s why there are churches, synagogues, temples, and mosques — so that religion is not just personal, but is part of one’s life as part of the community — spiritually, corporeally and collectively. You may chose to make your religion personal by practicing it in private and keeping your beliefs to yourself, but when you are part of a larger group of people who believe and practice the same set of beliefs, and support you in the community in part because of your dedication to your faith, you cannot dissociate yourself from that public group when it becomes convenient to do so and claim “this is a personal religious matter.”

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 13, 2009 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

And God said, "Let There Be Light"....and it was good.....

whew!!!…..now I know we were trying to avoid the religious implications of this discussion, and I guess that turned out to be impossible. But trying to get a state that is 90% Protestant to understand the reasoning of a Catholic is going to be impossible….but it was a good try Tru…..admirable

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 13, 2009 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

State, mabye

bit the city of Louisville is VERY Catholic. I’m sure still majority Protestant, but I’d bet well under 90%.

Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
--O.W.

by blbskue on Aug 13, 2009 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'll take a spiritual & political leader over a poet any day.

I win.

'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'

by HozeKing on Aug 13, 2009 9:26 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ben KIngsley in “Sexy Beast” > Ben Kingsley in “Ghandi”

/apropos of not much, just sayin’ that “Sexy Beast” is an awesome movie and everyone needs to see it if you haven’t yet

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 14, 2009 2:56 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Oh Please, tell me this ain't so... Here comes the Smoke

So much for an apology? Let the lawyers begin. As usual it will render us dazed, cynical . Why the heck did he pay for her health insurance? My goodness. It’s a play on the summer’s biggest political issue. If he’s going that route, he may be dumber than anyone thought. Again if that’s the tune he chooses to play: Slick Ricky , Kentucky is smarter than that. I am disappointed.

No matter where you're at, there you are

by cincyblue on Aug 12, 2009 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think Pitino "resigns."

I also think that the Louisville fans out there that consider this to be a non-issue or not a big deal are kidding themselves and are in very very deep denial. This is a very big deal and there is no way around that.

I predict Pitino does NOT coach next season.

It is not worth an intelligent man’s time to be in the majority. By definition, there are already enough people to do that.

by kentuckygirl0724 on Aug 12, 2009 4:18 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Only 1 comment from Hoze?

he is really laying low on this matter..

by 59Bennett on Aug 12, 2009 4:49 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Let's not bait.

If he wants to comment, he may.

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 12, 2009 6:28 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hoze

is quiet because the matter pertains to UofL. If the matter pertained to UK he would be chatting up a storm. He doesnt like to talk about the cards apparently. I think he’s a closet UK fan in denial.

DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!

by davw83 on Aug 12, 2009 5:18 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I have never brought up UofL in any issue on this site.

I don’t think it would be right or fair to people on this site. I never compared UK to UofL or vice versa. Others have but not me. Why would you expect me to weigh in now when things are difficult when I didn’t when the basketball season was great this past season?

'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'

by HozeKing on Aug 12, 2009 6:57 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

From one who couldn't find his _____ with two hands.

'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'

by HozeKing on Aug 13, 2009 10:09 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That was rude

I say i find your timing odd( not exactly an insult) and you replied with an insult.

You can be such a windbag man.

DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!

by davw83 on Aug 13, 2009 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

It was meant to be a joke.

I should have added the smiley face :-)

Now having written that, why is my ‘timing’ questioned?

'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'

by HozeKing on Aug 13, 2009 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That better stop.

You know that isn’t allowed.

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 13, 2009 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

If you don't mind,

I’ll reference this quote as a response to my ‘aggressors’.

'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'

by HozeKing on Aug 13, 2009 9:29 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Please

Quit being an ass to people and then whining about the mean UK fans who make negative comments towards you. That act is tired and sad.

DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!

by davw83 on Aug 14, 2009 9:22 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That better stop, you know that isn't allowed.

God, I love that quote.

Thanks for proving my point. This is really too easy.

'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'

by HozeKing on Aug 14, 2009 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Your delusional

DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!

by davw83 on Aug 14, 2009 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

He's right, you know.

You are. To almost everyone.

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 14, 2009 7:26 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

My money

is on Rick taking a leave of absence sometime during the coming year and Willard finishing the season. If things are still bad for him and his family, he resigns with the hope that Willard had a good year and can take over. If things are better for him and his family, or, possibly, if Willard flops in his place, he comes back.

by wklawdog on Aug 12, 2009 5:23 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

That would be a reasonable request

but Willard does not seem to have very many friends at UL…..word is that the boosters would rather face the grief related to sticking with Pitino than hire Willard.

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 12, 2009 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think this whole thing has been orchestrated...

To give him an excuse to lose to Coach Cal!!!!!

Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."

by chirop1 on Aug 12, 2009 5:26 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Are they playing tennis or something?

'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'

by HozeKing on Aug 12, 2009 7:37 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I just heard that Pitino

will make a public statement at 6:30 PM. It is to take place in the media room and he will not be taking questions. He had previously stated that he would not have any comments about this until he was on the witness stand. This may be something else? I have no idea.

Stay tuned.

Blue... there is no other color to Bleed !!!

by a2d2 on Aug 12, 2009 6:02 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Okay here's my position currently.

I don’t like it. Not one bit. My knee jerk reaction is dismiss him. This is the University of Louisville. It’s not the University of Pitino. I don’t think UofL needs Pitino or any other coach anymore than UK needs Calipari or IU needed Bobby Knight. UofL was pretty good before Pitino and will probably be pretty good after Pitino.

Of course, I need to understand my opinion is swayed by my morals having been faithfully married for 27 years without slipping. I don’t believe in abortion. Does that make me a saint? No. If someone slips on my ‘personal morality’ platform should they be fired?

I also have to understand that this issue happened 6 years ago. I don’t believe for a second it was rape.

So maybe it comes down to this question…..if someone had a sexual relationship with a woman outside of his marriage, is it enough to dismiss him? What if it happened 20 years ago? 30 years ago?

I just saw the tail end of the news conference. I am on the fence and at this point leaning toward making a change….but again, we don’t know the entire story, now do we?

'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'

by HozeKing on Aug 12, 2009 7:19 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

The time frame is an interesting point

To Pitino (and, perhaps, to his family), this is old news. To the rest of the world, this is just happening. I say this because I was struck by Pitino’s demeanor at his press statement. He was almost jovial, fighting a smile a few times. I thought it was a little strange.

But I think where the line stops about chronology is at the point he became an employee of the university. 2003 is certainly after that point, so if this had come out the day after it happened, the same ethical/legal/moral/etc. questions would have to be weighed. So I don’t think it is a valid mitigating circumstance here.

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 12, 2009 7:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well let's think about it...

1) This woman was not an employee of the university or state.
2) Regardless of what she said, the sex wasn’t (likely) against her will.
3) She was of age.
4) She wasn’t related.
5) She wasn’t married.
6) The sex didn’t occur during work or during a ‘business’ function. He wasn’t representing UofL at the time.
7) The sex didn’t happen on school or state grounds.

So basically it was two consenting adults having sex. It’s not illegal. It may be unethical and immoral…but is it really enough to have crossed the line?

'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'

by HozeKing on Aug 12, 2009 7:35 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Your mileage may vary

While married, he had sex on the floor of an Italian restaurant with a drunk woman he had met a few hours earlier (while another gentleman listened in), got her pregnant, and provided funds that he knew, indirectly at least, would lead to an abortion.

I don’t know where one crosses the line, but it’s at least within sight of there.

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 12, 2009 7:43 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Oh yeah

This all occurred at an ostensibly work-related event (Theus’s celebration) and as evidenced by the fact he had a university employee (my cousin Vinny) as his designated driver. I think that is relevant.

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 12, 2009 7:50 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

No it's not.

Given that arguement he can virtually never be away from work. It wasn’t like he did it under the table during dinner. Everyone had left, right? Again, would it have been better for you if they waited to get to a hotel?

'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'

by HozeKing on Aug 12, 2009 8:19 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't care either way

But some people will.

Although based on Ramsey’s comments post-Pitino, it looks like he’s in the all clear and nobody’s going anywhere.

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 12, 2009 8:21 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

And not "everyone" had left

Vinnie got a live sex show.

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 12, 2009 8:22 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Dismiss

I dont think UofL has enough to dismiss him. Morally I find his actions detestable but legally he’s done nothing wrong that we know of. Yes I know he has a morals clause but I think it’s fairly subjective.

DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!

by davw83 on Aug 13, 2009 9:25 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

UL President James Ramsey firesd a warning shot

UL President James Ramsey’s statement on Tuesday:

“Several months ago Coach Pitino informed me about the alleged extortion attempt. I’ve now been informed that there may be other details which, if true, I find surprising.”

Folks, I have to tell you, this does not sound good for febuk. Ultimately it doesn’t sound good for Tom Jurich either.

by Messenger on Aug 12, 2009 8:38 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

That was before the press conference

He’s since stated that they’re basically all good. At least that’s how I interpret his latest statement.

“Rick Pitino is the University of Louisville’s basketball coach. He has been a role model for countless young people and a positive influence on this community.

“Regardless of the truth or falsehood of specific actions that have been attributed to the coach, he’s clearly made errors in judgment that have come under intense public scrutiny. We can’t ignore these errors in judgment, and they have saddened and disappointed me. As we try to teach our students, when you make a mistake, you admit it and right it as best you can. Coach has done that today.”

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 12, 2009 9:10 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

no comment forthcoming obviously

from sideshowhoze

I LOVE COOKING WITH WINE
Sometimes I even put it in the food.

by bluecrip on Aug 13, 2009 8:15 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Good point

Nice perspective.

If Northwestern can do it, why can't we?

by NYCCats on Aug 13, 2009 8:40 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

+1

First time I shot her, shot her in the side.
Hard to watch her suffer, but with the second shot she died...

by btcoop71 on Aug 13, 2009 8:41 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

you dont have to lower your standards Tink....there is nothing wrong

with holding someone in his position to a higher standard when they mold young people’s lives…..thats part of what is wrong with the country today….no one holds anyone to a high standard…..it can be done without being judgemental…..no one is perfect, but there have to be people out there that are examples to the rest of the world….and he had a contract that said just that.

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 13, 2009 8:44 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Indeed.

Bravo.

This may be something Pitino can eventually put in the rearview mirror, both personally and professionally. But it will not, and should not be easy.

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 13, 2009 8:47 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I said it before and Ill say it again

Rick Pitino’s best job as a coach is either behind him or ahead of him…..its his choice as to which

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 13, 2009 8:49 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hmm ...

… but can’t that be said, in general, about us all? :-)

Just askin’ …

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 13, 2009 8:51 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

no arguments there Tru....none at all.....

he just happens to be the one on the hotseat at this time…..and as an old boss of mine said, maybe it’s just his time in the barrel.

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 13, 2009 8:53 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hah!

My old boss used to say that, too. Heh. Weird.

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 13, 2009 8:55 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The pregnancy and purpose of the money is Karen's perspective.

It’s best to remember that.

'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'

by HozeKing on Aug 13, 2009 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's true ...

… but you can’t isolate that fact from the larger context. Just sayin’…

A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan

by Truzenzuzex on Aug 13, 2009 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I am sorry....but that perspective argument wont fly and he knows it

Unless someone is an idiot, that one will be seen right through.

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 13, 2009 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

If i say the moon is cheese,

…will you reference that as a fact?

'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'

by HozeKing on Aug 13, 2009 2:31 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

Only if you think we didn't land on it......

First time I shot her, shot her in the side.
Hard to watch her suffer, but with the second shot she died...

by btcoop71 on Aug 13, 2009 3:05 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

coop....I know that lyric has to be from a bluegrass

song, which one??

Is that Pretty Polly??

and for all of you non-bluegrass music listeners, this is not something weird….lol

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 13, 2009 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Actually, I don't really listen to Bluegrass

I’m more of a Metallica kind of guy, throw in some Megadeth, Slipknot, Korn, and of course Johnny Cash.

First time I shot her, shot her in the side.
Hard to watch her suffer, but with the second shot she died...

by btcoop71 on Aug 14, 2009 9:06 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I could have sworn....oh well....

ahhh….heavy metal is just hard country with some extra distortion on the pedal anyway….lol….

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 14, 2009 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Is he only 50?

Sheesh.

Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
--O.W.

by blbskue on Aug 13, 2009 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I was thinking he is 56....?

Blue... there is no other color to Bleed !!!

by a2d2 on Aug 13, 2009 9:03 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Pitino's age

I am thinking more mid 50’s. He is older than Coach C. I was just thinking he is close to me in age.

by kykat51 on Aug 14, 2009 1:50 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

What's happened to Forty?

I havent seen him post in a looong time.

DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!

by davw83 on Aug 13, 2009 9:30 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

there is nothing statistical to be said

bout Spitino n Sypher ;)

I LOVE COOKING WITH WINE
Sometimes I even put it in the food.

by bluecrip on Aug 13, 2009 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

actually you probably could rack up some stats

on this situation….% of stupidity in allowing yourself to get caught up in this situation
greatest # of jokes concerning a collegiate basketball coach for an off-season incident….
$$ saved by paying someone instead of having your assistant marry them
the list goes on and on…..

I am just not sure 40 keeps those kinds of stats, or knows where to look them up!!!!

Remember, we're having fun now!!!

by ALLBLUCAT on Aug 16, 2009 8:56 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

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