A very early look at Kentucky's place in the SEC for 2008-09 -- Part 3
We have already looked at the strengths, weaknesses, opportunities and threats for UK basketball in the 2008-09 season. What I'd like to do now is tie all that together into a coherent picture of how I see the SEC next year.
Eastern Division
The main three threats to win the Eastern division next year, as I see it, are Tennessee and Kentucky, Florida and Vanderbilt in that order. You may want to look at the previous overall analysis of the East I did a couple of weeks back.
Tennessee returns a good portion of their highly successful 2007-08 team, but their losses are critical ones. Chris Lofton brought heart, brains and pure shooting. JaJuan Smith brought tremendous athleticism and scoring ability. Losing these two players alone would be enough to set the Volunteers back a bit. But the dismissal of veteran big man Duke Crews and combo guard Ramar Smith, both 5-star players out of high school makes it tougher.
Tennessee will be larger and somewhat slower next year due to the fact that less athletic players Jurick and Williams will be spending most of the time in the post, and will lose much of its devastating perimeter game. Overall, I see the Vols being considered a slight favorite over Kentucky because of uncertainty surrounding the UK point guard situation, but I'm going to call them even for this moment.
Kentucky adds a lot of athleticism and length, but loses most of its scoring. The two big questions right now are Jasper's decision and Liggins' qualification. Liggins did not achieve a qualifying score in his last attempt, and now has two more tries, one at the SAT and one at the ACT in June. If one of those does not achieve qualifying levels and Jasper does not return, Kentucky will have major problems at the point. But if either Jasper returns or Liggins qualifies, Kentucky should have a good shot at the East.
The thing to like about the Kentucky team that we have yet to see is their potential for being a truly special defensive team. Lead by last year's defensive stopper Ramon Harris, Gillispie has recruited the kind of long, athletic players that should be capable of inflicting agonizing scoring droughts on opposing teams, and taking the heart from their offense. What this team appears to lack is sufficient scoring threats, but there has been some remarks by Ramel Bradley that Kevin Galloway is capable of scoring. Whatever the case, with Patterson and Meeks back at full speed, some size in the middle and a point guard to run the show, this Wildcat team is a major threat to reclaim the Wildcat's rightful place on top of the Eastern Division. First or second in the East, depending on the resolution of the point guard problem.
Florida has the talent to win the East, but we don't know if they have the heart or mix of personnel. Last year, the Gators were soft in the middle with Maurice Speights the only real post threat. This year, the Gators shore up their front line with 4-stars Kenny Kadji, Allan Chaney and Eloy Vargas.
The big question for the Gators remains Speights. He has declared for the NBA draft, and he is absolutely critical to the Gators' hopes next year. If Speights returns, the Gators contend for the East. If he does not, they are likely to wind up third behind Kentucky and Tennessee. With some mock drafts showing Speights going in the mid to late first round, I consider it only about a 40% chance that he returns at this point. Florida looks like a solid third in the East next year to me, but Vince Gagliano at Orange and Blue Hue has more on their chances.
Western Division
Alabama, Mississippi State and Ole Miss in that order are the three teams that I think will compete for the West. Arkansas cannot be ruled out, as John Pelprhey has some nice young talent returning, but I think their youth is such that an SEC West championship will be a bridge too far for them. Again, you can refer to my previous West analysis to see details.
Alabama just looks ridiculous on paper. Richard Hendrix is, "testing the NBA waters," but his odds of going in the first round are not that great. I would place his odds of a return at 50%. Ronald Steele is also in the draft without an agent, but the smart money is on him returning. These two guys alone aught to give Alabama the best team in the West, but there is way more than that to the Crimson Tide's 2008-09 team. As up and down as 'Bama was last year, their only significant loss was Mykal Riley. As usual with the Tide, they bring in an absolutely awesome recruiting class lead by Rivals 5-star Jamychal Green.
The think about Alabama is that they just don't seem to get that much out of the great talent they produce. Still, they should be more than a match for any team not from Mississippi, and they will be at least even with either of those two. Strong first place pick.
Mississippi State will contend for top honors in the West. If you will notice, in my earlier evaluation of the West, I had Mississippi picked to win the league. I have changed my mind on that. Judging from the tenor of Jamont Gordon's remarks, I expect him to stay in the draft. If he does, the two Mississippi teams will likely fight it out for second place in the West. MSU loses Charles Rhodes to graduation in addition to the likely defection of Gordon, but has a nice stable of players and some excellent recruits coming.
Rick Stansbury has done a very good job of coaching this team, and I look for the Bulldogs to once again compete for the West. The loss of Ben Hansbrough does not help their outside shooting, but the addition of Demarquis Bost and Romero Osby will more than make up for his loss. My pick as a strong second in the West.
Ole Miss may seem an unlikely contender for the West, but Andy Kennedy can coach, and continues to bring in and develop solid talent for this once-struggling ball club. Ole Miss loses Dwayne Curtis and Kenny Williams, the Beef Brothers that the Rebs have used to great effect the last couple of years. But Ole Miss still has some young players with serious size, and have brought in a nice but unspectacular recruiting class.
But all-SEC waterbug Chris Warren will be back, and he gives them a dimension in quickness that virtually no other team in the SEC can match. He showed excellent leadership ability as a freshman, and now as a sophomore, he will be very tough. Look for the Rebels to slug it out with MSU for the second and third spots next year in the West.
The SEC overall
Overall, I look for the following overall finish in the SEC next year:
- Kentucky -- I think Kentucky will surprise the pundits and win the SEC next year. Call me crazy, call me partisan, but don't call me scared to take a stand. History is on my side.
- Tennessee -- Vols still talented, could be #1 just as easily.
- Alabama -- Should win it all, but won't.
- MSU -- Solid team, could contend for #2 if Gordon comes back.
- Florida -- I think Speights leaves.
- Ole Miss -- Andy Kennedy and Chris Warren are the reasons.
I see 6 teams from the SEC headed to the NCAA tourney next year, as above. To the NIT, I see:
- Vanderbilt -- May make the NCAA. Loss of seniors will kill them next year.
- Arkansas -- Young, young talent. Young coach. Will be great at times, and lousy at times, but watch out in 2009.
- Georgia -- A year away from contending in the East.
That's it, ladies and gentlemen. Five parts and many hours at the keyboard later, I have examined next year as thoroughly as possible at this point. The SEC will be improved next year, but only incrementally. I look to 2009 for the SEC to return to the top of college basketball, and remain there for a few years.
But for now, the long interregnum between this year and next year has come, also known as "summertime." We will be picking this back up as we get closer to the fall.
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Good breakdown
I’ve never quite understood Gottfried’s problems at Alabama. As you note, he gets great talent year in and year out… and then does nothing with it. What is most shocking about that is the fact that regardless of this fact he still gets the talent!!!!
The SEC may seem weak overall, but I still think that is a perception caused by the fact that Kentucky is down. Duke and North Carolina have shown repeatedly that a conference is viewed strong when the traditional powers are really good. Get Kentucky back on top and get the other teams to take their turns in the upper echelons of college bball and the SEC will be perceived as strong again.
Lastly, I just want to head over to DeAndre Liggins’ house and sit down and teach him the pythagorean theorem or something that can help the man qualify on the ACT! Seriously, what is a qualifying score there? 12? 13? I had some pretty smart friends who weren’t good at taking tests who scored a 19… so I know the qualifying score has to be pretty low.
Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."
by chirop1 on May 21, 2008 9:26 AM EDT 0 recs
Ha!
I wish I could somehow develop a hyper-learning technology like on the old Star Trek TOS episode, “Spock’s Brain,” and use that to make him a genius for a few days. Or at least shoot him some test prep.
:-)
A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan
by Truzenzuzex on
May 21, 2008 9:35 AM EDT
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Ah yes... the one where McCoy does a brain transplant...
And says “Of course… its so simple…” and then he promptly forgets everything he knew.
Another option could be like the end of the old 1960’s Batman movie where all the UN representatives are turned into grains of sand and then get mixed up. Batman then tries to separate them all out into their original sandpiles before reconstituting them and they end up speaking other languages and all sorts of other shikanery. It’s so crazy it just… might… work… Now, if only we could get him into a room with a Nobel Laureate physicist…
Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."
by chirop1 on
May 21, 2008 9:47 AM EDT
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Disagree about
Arkansas. I think Arkansas takes the West and goes to Sweet Sixteen. I don’t have facts or evidence, just a gut feeling. I am also at work and will expound on this subject more once I am at a computer that I can write more freely at.
by bluecrip on May 21, 2008 12:57 PM EDT 0 recs
Glass Half Empty?
I begrudge no one for taking a stand or expressing an opinion. However, the unbridled optimism being expressed on this site recently regarding Kentucky’s chances next year remind me of the many posts from message boards past lamenting the fact that Kentucky fans often suffer from unrealistic expecations that, invariably, lead to disappointment (and increased sales of adult beverages) as the season progresses.
Bottom line, folks, is that we had only three legit scorers last season and two of them have graduated. Other than our one bona fide super star-Mr. Patterson-we have a returning roster filled with role players like Stevenson, Harris, Meeks, and Porter, not one of whom has shown that he can take over a game offensively and consistently score in double digits against top notch competition . Sure, we have some promising incoming freshman and a JC transfer who look good on paper (albeit against lesser competition). However, history teaches us that we cannot count on these newcomers to lead our team, immediately, to greener pastures. Therefore, if for no other reason than to bring balance to this board, I respectfully disagree with our host’s prediction of great things next year for our Cats. Instead, I forsee a defensively tough, scrappy team that will pay hard from start to finish but will find it extremely difficult to score points, especially against the teams that can match up well against Patterson. I hope I am wrong and that Tru is right. However, unless one of last year’s role players grows into the type of player who can take over games and create scoring opportunities when the offense breaks down, I do not see us contending for the SEC East title next season.
There…I said it…please go easy on me with your responses.
by tooblue on May 21, 2008 3:42 PM EDT 0 recs
HEATHEN! I BANISH YOU TO A HELL OF UofL ONLY TV COVERAGE!!!
Its a fair critique. But I think that if you’ll notice, this is part three of his analysis. The first part dealt with Strenghts and Weaknesses and the second part Opportunities and Threats. Go back and read the Weaknesses and Threats parts of parts one and two… you’ll see your concerns echoed there.
Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."
by chirop1 on
May 21, 2008 3:52 PM EDT
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Links for you
http://www.aseaofblue.com/2008/5/15/507658/a-very-early-look-at-kentu
http://www.aseaofblue.com/2008/5/17/519628/a-very-early-look-at-kentu
Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."
by chirop1 on
May 21, 2008 3:54 PM EDT
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I reluctantly agree
We had three scorers last year, yet we struggled to win games. Most teams would be happy with one or two scorers. I don’t think last year’s team ever learned how to run Billy’s offense. We scored some points off defense, but most of the points came from Patterson, Bradley and Crawford going one on one. There wasn’t much crisp passing that got somebody an easy basket.
I think the defense will be there. Billy has made it abundantly clear that if you don’t play defense, you don’t play—period. I agree that we will be able to make it very difficult for teams to score for 5-7 minute stretches during a game.
But somehow we gotta score. Patterson has incredible shooting touch. He is somewhat mechanical when he catches the ball and starts to move - he’s not exceptionally quick - but he has great touch. He makes off-balance shots under great pressure from defenders. Last year, Pitino put two big guys on him and shut him down. He kept trying to shoot - and got blocked - he didn’t pass out to the wing effectively.
Stevenson will be better; Harris will be better; but Stevenson ain’t gonna be a Kenny Walker, and Harris ain’t no Jack Givens reincarnated. Patterson maybe will be better, but opposing teams will be better at shutting him down, especially when there is no other real scoring threat.
Best I can firgure, Billy had success at UTEP because he motivated kids to do better, work harder, focus. At A&M it was AC Law who made Billy successful. A lead/point guard who could score. Like Ramel Bradley. Last year, he also had Joe Crawford, a guard who could take the ball to the rim and score, or get fouled and hit free throws.
My conception of a really good basketball team is five players who are always looking - when they have the basketball - to find somebody closer to the basket to pass the ball to; and if they don’t have the ball, they are working to get close to the basket to receive a pass. But there also have to be rules about spacing on the court.
Meeks obviously has athleticism, and he is a great kid. He has potential. But Joe Hall once said that potential is a French word that means ain’t worth crap right now.
If Jasper stays and can play at full strength, Patterson, Harris, Stevenson, Stewart—they’ll be better.
If my perception that last year’s team didn’t really figure out how to implement Billy’s offense is correct, then why should any of us assume that freshmen and Jucos are going to be able to master it right away? I hope I’m wrong.
by Fortunatus on
May 22, 2008 12:11 AM EDT
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If Jasper Stays (And Is Able To Play)
UK will be much improved. But Cats will be better than 2008 team regardless.
by FortyYearCatFan on
May 22, 2008 7:10 AM EDT
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I believe ...
... what we’ll see this year is a much shallower learning curve, both for the coach and for the team. I think had last year been Gillispie’s second year instead of his first, we would have been a much better basketball team.
I think people worry too much about scoring. The thing is, we appear to have lots of guys who can score a little—the New And Improved Perry Stevenson can average 10 ppg. Ramon Harris is capable of putting in 8-10. Kevin Galloway should be able to score 8-10. Josh Harrellson 6-8. Darius Miller 8-10. Jasper, if he stays, 8-10.
So while we don’t appear to have a lot of “go to” scorers who can get their own shot, we do have many people capable of putting the ball into the basket a few times a game. I think we’ll be fine in that area.
What I really like is the defensive potential of next year’s team. I believe they could be devastating. They will be long and athletic and very aggressive defensively. Scoring on Kentucky next year is likely to be very tough.
A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan
by Truzenzuzex on
May 22, 2008 7:52 AM EDT
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Gillispie's 2nd Year History
From 6 W to 24 W at UTEP.
From 21 W to 22 W at TAMU.
From 18 W to ?? at UK.
I think 25 W possibly.
by FortyYearCatFan on
May 22, 2008 8:58 PM EDT
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Ouch!
The Heathen comment I can handle…but the banishment to “U of L Only TV Coverage” is pretty harsh. That one is going to leave a mark.
by tooblue on May 21, 2008 3:55 PM EDT 0 recs
Good behaviour
If you behave yourself, we’ll let you watch a Duke game or two in a few years.
Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."
by chirop1 on
May 21, 2008 4:18 PM EDT
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ASoB Commentator Justice is Harsh, but Fair
I honestly agree with tooblue. I think right now is the time for optimism, and Tru acknowledges this is a very, very early look. But we have too much volatility within our team. Patterson needs at least two somebodies to step up outside and for drives. Unless Liggins - if he gets here! - or whoever our lead guard pulls a Patterson and plays like a junior during his freshman year, I honestly doubt we will be able to win so many of the close games we won this past year.
The Online Home of the Big Blue Nation...
by TheFakeGimelMartinez on May 21, 2008 5:48 PM EDT 0 recs
Optimism is a must now ....
with our Cats and Coach, even everyday life situations.
I honestly trust BCG to bring the BBN back to the forefront, but it may take another year unless the team does some very unexpected things this next season.
Go Big Blue!
by kykat51 on
May 21, 2008 6:04 PM EDT
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1966, 1973, 1991
All very much unexpected.
Y not 2009 also?
by FortyYearCatFan on May 21, 2008 11:06 PM EDT 0 recs
half full for me
I feel that the line between reality and past apathy is where our fanbase is at,in general.We have lost alot of games in the past 3 years,and it has been a decade since we have beaten a high seed(1,2,3) in the NCAA tourney.I have alot of faith in BG,because he has proven he can turn things around(NCAA record,twice)and because he was under Bill Self,who was able to build 2 different teams to make it to the Final Four.I think this season we will be better,not worse.
by -Zoso- on May 24, 2008 10:38 AM EDT 0 recs
UK Vs High Seeds (1, 2, Or 3) Since 1992 NCAA
http://www.bigbluehistory.net/bb/statistics/gamencaa.html Cats are 9-8 vs “high seeds” in that timeframe.
7-0 vs “high seeds” in 1996-97-98. But 2-8 the rest of those years. Shows how much 96-97-98 was “unusual” for UK.
Gillispie has never beaten a “high seed” in NCAA so now would be a good time to start.
by FortyYearCatFan on May 24, 2008 10:58 AM EDT 0 recs
All-Time Vs High Seeds
http://www.bigbluehistory.net/bb/statistics/gamencaa.html UK is 11-11 vs “high seeds” all-time.
by FortyYearCatFan on May 24, 2008 10:59 AM EDT 0 recs
The Only Time UK Beat 3 High Seeds Was 1998
Impressive year indeed. Coming off losing 6 NBA draft picks and 8 quality players, UK “leftovers” won 35 games, NCAA title, SEC title, SECT champiosnhip, beat Duke for the only time UK has done so in 30 years, and defeated 3 straight “high seeds” and 30+ W teams to close out the season.
Very VERY special year at UK.
by FortyYearCatFan on May 24, 2008 12:39 PM EDT 0 recs








