Morning Newspaper for December 30th
by Truzenzuzex on Dec 30, 2008 9:14 AM EST
in News
161 comments
Tuesday is always sweeter after a victory, but now it's time for us to gird our loins for battle with the Louisville Cardinals in Freedom Hall. We'll be talking more about that over the coming days, and in today's news I will begin with a section on the game.
Kentucky vs. Louisville 2008-09 news
- Mark Story says the 'Cats have questions to answer against the Cards. Yes, they certainly do. He also points out that against UK's big three non-conference rivals, Gillispie is 1-4.
Other UK basketball news
- Tipton looks at last night's game against CMU.
- DeAndre Liggins addresses the media. I hope this puts the Vegas episode to bed now.
- Jerry Tipton also has a story on Liggins' availability with audio. I found this very telling:
Patience does not come easy when friends and family sing a player's praises and wonder aloud why the coach isn't playing him more.
"I hear that from everybody," Liggins said. "I've just got to wait my turn. That's what I tell them."
Asked how that response plays with his family and friends, Liggins said, "They react (by saying) 'Maybe you should be playing.
Friends and family and their desires for a player to do well have often unintentionally become impediments to their career. We have seen this before, and I'm glad DeAndre didn't let it get the best of him. This situation could have gone very badly for UK and Liggins.
- The Courier-Journal has more on last night's game.
- Straightpinkie has thoughts, and was encouraged by Liggins getting the start.
- Slone energizes the crowd in Rupp Arena, according to this article in the Cincinnati Enquirer. No doubt that's true, but will the Cardinals out-athlete him and negate his hustling, determined effort?
- Richard Skinner of the Cincinnati Enquirer says the 'Cats still face questions, and these questions are pretty much identical to what UK fans have expressed on this blog and elsewhere.
UK Football news
- Tickets still available for Liberty Bowl.
- ECU wary of the 'Cats.
- Benching matures Hartline, according to the Commercial-Appeal. It sounds like he has.
- A view of the Liberty Bowl from an ECU fan.
- Kentucky's receiving corps has something to prove, according to this H-L article. Yes, they most certainly do, especially with Randall Cobb unavailable. Maybe this month off has helped, I sure hope so.
NCAA Basketball news
- Tubby Smith to Arizona? Wouldn't that be an irony?
- Wayne Chism of Tennessee was hurt in a game last night with Louisiana-Lafayette. He is said to have hurt his back and neck after falling hard. At this point, we don't know the extent of his injuries, but I'm sure you all will join me in a prayer that his injuries are minor and his recovery is speedy.
- Rocky Top Talk has more on Chism here.
- Joel at Rocky Top Talk asks, "Just how good is this Tennessee team?" I don't know, but like Kentucky, we are all going to find out soon.
- Michigan has already won as many games this year as last.
NCAA Football news
- Preview of the Music City Bowl.
- Missouri defeats Northwestern in the Alamo Bowl.
- Nick Saban named AP Coach of the Year. I'd say he definitely deserves that honor.
- All eyes on Percy Harvin. No doubt without him, the Gators will be in trouble.
- U.S.C. is tired of playing in the Rose Bowl every year. You need some cheese with that whine, guys.
Other news
- Eric Crawford has more on the SAT score study I linked to yesterday.
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Tubby Won't Be Going To Arizona
He and Donna love it in Minnesota. The Gophers will be Big 10 contenders soon and perhaps more someday.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 10:30 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Arizona
Mark Few, maybe?
It’s time for him to see if he can do it at BCS level school.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 10:32 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Definitely agree...
Few is one of the “under the radar” (loathe that cliche) coaches who I think is always mentioned when a significant job opens up, but is ostensibly waiting for the job that he feels really suits him instead of brazenly jumping at the first “big” opportunity. I also respect his allegiance to Gonzaga. I think he’s been on the staff since I was a little kid, and he’s seen the program ascend into the upper echelon of D1 basketball…it’s amazing the consistency his teams have shown. Despite the absolute black hole of talent that comes after the Zags in the WCC, when they get into the national spotlight, they rarely disappoint (3 Sweet Sixteens in 9 years).
That Tubby-to-Arizona column is a classic example of the tactic often resorted to by columnists who can’t think of anything interesting, timely, or substantive to write about before a deadline, so they pose ridiculous and wildly speculative hypotheticals that will get topical fans “thinking,” fans with a vested interest in the speculation (Minnesota basketball fans) angry, and others – seemingly like us – to quickly read and subsequently dismiss the story as ridiculous.
by mrmondaynite on Dec 30, 2008 10:58 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Now that I look at it, it is more like a blog than a column...
but what I said is still true.
by mrmondaynite on Dec 30, 2008 11:08 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Look at the first comment left
under the Tubby-to-Arizona column…hahahaha.
by mrmondaynite on Dec 30, 2008 11:00 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Pretty Dumb Comment, That Was
No one would leave Kentucky for Arizona.
And Lute Olson declined the reverse trip. Twice, 1985 and again in 1989.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 11:59 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm new here
I’ve been reading ASOB for a few months now. I love it! I’m sure I’ll be around posting a lot. This place looks like it can be pretty addictive… :o
by OGETARTS on Dec 30, 2008 11:11 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Welcome!
We’re glad to have you. Thanks for reading.
A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan
by Truzenzuzex on Dec 30, 2008 11:25 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I’m
Having a bit of trouble with two of the "Other UK Basketball News" links? Is it just me?
The first Tipton link takes me to Brett Dawson’s bit about Liggins addressing the media that will be coming in a later article and the straightpinkie link takes me to the Courier-Journal’s article about last night’s game, not the piece about Liggins’ first start?
Btw, I just love the "Morning Newspaper" edition again and I totally appreciate it — Thanks!
by BigSkyCat on Dec 30, 2008 11:12 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
That's because ...
… I goofed and linked it wrong. :-)
Fixed now.
A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan
by Truzenzuzex on Dec 30, 2008 11:28 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree Big Sky Cat
With the “Morning Newspaper” edition.
But Tru is making us lazy and spoiled . :-) Thanks Tru! I enjoy being lazy and spoiled in my old age.
by kykat51 on Dec 30, 2008 5:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Tubby at Arizona?
I don’t see that happening.. if he couldn’t take UK to a Final four why would Arizona expect him to be able to there? OK, I can’t resist.. maybe if Pitino goes to Arizona, dominates college basketball there, then leaves with a stacked roster.. then maybe Tubby should consider that job. :)
by MyBloodRunsBlue on Dec 30, 2008 12:54 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
He Did (1998)
Too bad U missed it. UK defeated 3 straight 30 W (plus) opponents, including its only W over Duke in 30 years.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 1:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Pitino & Tubby
Both came to UK to get their championship… none before they got here, and none after they left (at least they haven’t yet)…
Kentucky will be Kentucky no matter who the coach is… We’ll have good years and bad years, but in the end, “WE ARE College Basketball”
Steelers fan 1st! UK is my 2nd love.
by vinceuk1 on Dec 30, 2008 2:06 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Pitino
Has dominated college basketball in over 10 years.
Heck, he can’t even dominate Big East basketball.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 1:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
EDIT Function Badly Neede
HASN’T dominated.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 1:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
In case you missed it...
he is the only coach to take 3 different teams to a Final Four… multiple Final Fours at UK..
and in case you missed it, that was Pitino’s team.. Tubby road his coattails..
and in case you missed it, Tubby couldn’t dominate Vandy.
Tubby is where he belongs.. at a schol where 20+ wins and no Final Fours is significant. He doesn’t belong where elite coaches belong.
by MyBloodRunsBlue on Dec 30, 2008 2:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'll just sit back and watch the comments count blow up now...
Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."
by chirop1 on Dec 30, 2008 2:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Except to say...
if I had to pick one of them to lead my team, all allegiances aside, I would pick Pitino.
by mrmondaynite on Dec 30, 2008 2:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Tubby Has The Better Record In 2K's
Pitino was better in the 1990’s.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 4:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Pitino WAS A Great Coach
WAS being the key word.
Wasn’t in Boston. Isn’t at Louisville.
Over the hill.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 4:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree somewhat
but Pitino was ahead of the curve in the 90’s and the game has caught up to him.If you think Pitino is over the hill,you must really hate Joe Paterno,who BTW is coaching in the upcoming Rose Bowl.
by -Zoso- on Dec 30, 2008 5:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Great In The 1990's
Not so great in 2000’s.
He’s a much better coach with Jim O’Brien assisting him and Billy Donovan recruiting for him. THEY produced the 1995-96-97-98-99 players and 3/5 of the results from then.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 7:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
3/5
not sure where you got the 60% from, but you’re willing to take credit away from pitino, but 1998 was all tubby (i agree with you there, so no need to repeat how you feel). i realize it’s different circumstances, but it find it interesting.
GO BIG BLUE!! GO BIG BLUE!!
by UKWildCatFanatic on Dec 30, 2008 8:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
JOB And Donovan Get 3/5 Of Credit (1995-96-97) Along With Pitino
Tubby gets credit for 1998 & 99. He had leftovers (no full-time starters, no 10 ppg scorers, no All-SEC players) but won anyway. Pitino gets credit for letting Billy D recruit them to UK.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 8:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Not Worth Spit Any More
Pitino WAS.
That says it all.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 4:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Why so bitter, FYCF?
Thou dost protest too much. You kind of remind my of that little boy in kindergarten that can’t help but pull that little girl’s pigtails because he secretly likes her.
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Dec 30, 2008 6:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Pitino Is A Good Coach
He was a great coach.
Not today.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 7:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah...
you basically refuted my “I’d take Pitino over BCG and Tubby” comment 3 times, essentially saying the same thing in each instance.
by mrmondaynite on Dec 30, 2008 7:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Forty
Rick Pitino went to the Elite 8 THIS YEAR.So you think he is over the hill and washed up after going to the Elite 8 this year, you are a fool.
by -Zoso- on Dec 30, 2008 7:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Check His NCAA W-L Record From 2002 Thru 2008
You’ll find it no so stellar. His NIT record (lately) IS pretty good.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 7:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
LOL... now that was a dig...
the NIT reference…
Steelers fan 1st! UK is my 2nd love.
by vinceuk1 on Dec 30, 2008 7:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
9-5 NCAA W-L Record At U Of L
Tubby was 11-6 in the same timeframe.
Edge to Tubby there.
Edge to Tubby in overall W-L record from 2002 thru 2008, too.
Ditto, edge to Tubby head-2-head also.
3 strikes, Pitino’s out.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 7:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry...
“Dark Knight” reference…can’t stop watching it.
by mrmondaynite on Dec 30, 2008 7:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Tubby accumulates 20 wins seasons..
while Pitino accumulates Final Four appearances. Not only did UL make it to the Elite 8 last year, but UL went to the Final Four 3 years ago. Tubby was blessed with Pitino’s team to make his way to his one and only Final Four 11 years ago. For a guy who likes to spew a lot of facts, you certainly missed those.
Pitino was, is and always will be a far superior coach than Tubby. Hey, don’t be so bitter… Tubby is a fine coach, just not elite and certainly not in the league of Pitino and there is no shame in that.
by MyBloodRunsBlue on Dec 30, 2008 7:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
For what it's worth...
I receive (The Sporting News) magazine and they rate each coach on each team..
BCG & OTS are both listed as 4 stars…
Traitor Rick is listed as a 5 star…
For what it’s worth… lol
Steelers fan 1st! UK is my 2nd love.
by vinceuk1 on Dec 30, 2008 7:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Based On Current Results
Pitino is nowhere near 5 Star level.
He’s hanging on as 4 Star for now,
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 7:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm just telling you how "professionals" rank the coaches...
not my rankings, I’m no professional, that’s for sure….lol
Steelers fan 1st! UK is my 2nd love.
by vinceuk1 on Dec 30, 2008 7:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
They Rank Him Based On His 1990's
Not on his 2000’s for sure.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 7:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'd say you are correct right there...
Steelers fan 1st! UK is my 2nd love.
by vinceuk1 on Dec 30, 2008 7:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
1990's Or 2000's (Pitino)
219-50 (81) and 22-5 (81) in NCAA games in 90’s.
177-69 (72) and 9-5 (64) in NCAA games in 2K’s.
The former are elite numbers. The latter are not.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 7:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
90's Or 2K's (Tubby)
187-75 (71) and 15-5 (75) in NCAA games in 90’s.
232-84 (73) and 14-8 (64) in NCAA games in 2K’s.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 7:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If That's True
Why has he lost 5 of 7 games to him from 2002 thru 2008?
It WAS true, just isn’t any more.
Look at his NCAA record from 2002 thru 2008.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 7:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think most people (except haters) would agree.....
that both coaches are in the elite category. Each coach brings different strengths to the table. Pitino being a better recruiter and game planner while Tubby is a better “in game” coach in my opinion. Both can take lesser players and mold them into a good team.
And for those that say that Tubby only won with Pitino’s players miss a few things. Tubby could have lost with those same players. There is no gaurantee at all that Pitino would have won it all with those same players.
Slower Traffic Keep Right!
by SevenRings on Dec 30, 2008 7:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Actually, I Don't Agree
Neither is currently elite (Top 5-10) level. Both are in the next tier.
But Tubby has > record(s) in the 2000’s than Pitino.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 7:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
As long as you get to set the criteria to justify your thoughts....
then you will never be wrong. I would say there are 10-15 elite coaches and both are in there somewhere.
Slower Traffic Keep Right!
by SevenRings on Dec 30, 2008 7:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That's Where They Are Ranked By NCAA Website
Pitino 12, Tubby 13.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 7:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
name me 10 better coaches then both those guys..
Steelers fan 1st! UK is my 2nd love.
by vinceuk1 on Dec 30, 2008 7:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Off The Top Of My Head (Based On W-L Record, Not Perception)
Calhoun, Self, Donovan, Williams, Coach K, Few, Boeheim, Pearl, Izzo.
That’s 9 off the top of head.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 7:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I certainly do not buy that....
Self, Pearl, Few and Boeheim are better coaches. They may be on par but not better and I don’t care what kind of stats you try to justify it with.
Slower Traffic Keep Right!
by SevenRings on Dec 30, 2008 8:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I am laughing out loud...
…or crying because this is so childish.
Few, Boeheim, and Pearl better than Pitino? There is not a coach in America that would put them in front of Pitino. Likewise, although I appreciate Tubby probably more than most on this site, there is no way I’d rate the ‘student over the teacher’…and neither would Tubby. I don’t even know if Tubby was even coaching when Pitino went to the Final Four with Providence….same with Few and Pearl, I would think.
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Dec 30, 2008 8:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I am too...
Come on now, 40. Pearl himself was on Louisville sports radio a month or so ago and kept harping on and on about how badly Pitino out-coached him in the tournament last year. He was as emphatic and genuine about that as could be. No chance in hell Pearl is a better coach than Pitino. Pearl said so himself, haha.
Hasn’t Boeheim missed the tournament the last two years? An they’re in the same conference last time I checked. He hasn’t won a tournament game since 2003-04 season, and Pitino has beaten him head-to-head the last two years.
Few is just a strange pick. I’m not really sure how to compare the two coaches, because Gonzaga is kind of a unique beast…still, I’m not buying that either.
The rest you can make valid arguments for (or against), but no way is Few, Boeheim, or Pearl better than Pitino.
by BBallSophist on Dec 30, 2008 8:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Pearl Has Better W-L Record Than Pitino In 2K's
It’s that simple.
Too many the 90’s Pitino with the version today.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 8:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Pitino Missed It Twice In 2K's Also
2 NIT appearances for him, too.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 8:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Pitino Has 1 FF In 2K's, Boeheim Has 1 NC in 2K's
That’s easy.
Pearl and Few are MUCH better W-L record in 2K’s than Pitino.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 8:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm thinking my kid's
….old 8th grade coach has a better record in the 2000’s (I refuse to type 2K’s) than Pitino. Let’s put him on the list.
Also I think that my dog has a pretty good Won-Lost record on attempts out in my back yard when I put him out…let’s include him too.
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Dec 30, 2008 8:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Div I Records
Pitino great in 90’s. Good in 2K’s.
It’s that simple. He’s not great lately.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 8:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
See, this is why stats can be so misleading.
There are any number of statistics you can throw out that allegedly confirm something such as “X is a better coach than Y”. Anytime someone makes a counter-argument, you have a wealth of statistics available to cherry pick from, while ignoring other ones which are clearly at odds with your position. Nevermind the fact that you consistently ignore the context of the statistics you use.
Are number of national championships the benchmark, or is it the overall win/loss record? Or is the overall record in the NCAA tournament? How about the number of league tournament championships won? League tournament wins? League records? Head-to-head records? Does it matter if the sample size is larger for one coach or the other (yes I think it does)?
What about the fact that Pitino didn’t become coach of Louisville until 2001 and had to work to re-build the team vs. Boeheim having been head coach at Syracuse since 1976? What about Pearl getting to coach in leagues with significantly easier competition from top to bottom than Pitino? Does Pearl emphatically admitting that Pitino is a much better coach than he is mean anything?
Pitino has 1FF in 2K’s, Tubby Has 0FF in 2K’s, so it’s that easy, right? No, let’s use head-to-head numbers in this one. Tubby is better.
Pitino has 1FF, 1 Elite Eight, in 2K’s, Pearl has 2SS, so it’s that easy, right? No, let’s use overall records in 2K’s to compare. Pearl is better.
Pitino has won 2/3 against Boeheim since entering the Big East and has had a MUCH better overall record in the league for those 3 years, so it’s that easy, right? No, let’s use the 1 championship as the trump card. By this logic, Gary Williams and Boeheim are better than Coach K and Tubby Smith. And Boeheim is better than Pitino.
Stats only tell half the story. Yeah, Pitino has been to two NITs, but one of those came in his first year at Louisville with a bad team inherited from Crum. Boeheim’s team was all his own the last two years, as was the schedule.
Stats are good for supporting your argument, but if you use them without taking any number of external factors into context, they are meaningless.
Again, Bruce Pearl himself has stated that Pitino is a better coach than he. That’s not a statistic, that’s a personal testimony from one of the subjects of discussion.
For what it’s worth, I don’t think Pitino is as good now as he was in the 90’s either. But Bruce Pearl, Mark Few, and Jim Boeheim are not better than Pitino. Not right now. I don’t care which statistics you use. Few and Pearl may be better some day, but both have a lot to prove still (neither have been past the sweet 16 yet) and since that championship, Boeheim has had very little success. Pitino has been better in the second half of 2K’s. They might be equal over the course of the decade so far, but at the moment Pitino has the upper hand.
by BBallSophist on Dec 30, 2008 9:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
There Are 3 Benchmarks
(In 2K’s ONLY)
Overall W-L record.
W-L in NCAA games.
W-L head-2-head.
If it’s all about FF only, Jim Larranga = Rick Pitino in 2K’s.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 9:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Absolutely Boeheim BETTER Than Pitino In 2K's
Williams has better NCAA record but not overall.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 9:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Boeheim's 2K's Record
999-2000 Syracuse 26 6 Lost in NCAA Sweet 16
2000-2001 Syracuse 25 9 Lost in NCAA 2nd Rd
2001-2002 Syracuse 23 13 Lost in NIT Semi-Finals
2002-2003 Syracuse 30 5 National Champions
2003-2004 Syracuse 23 8 Lost in NCAA Sweet 16
2004-2005 Syracuse 27 7 Lost in NCAA 1st Rd
2005-2006 Syracuse 23 12 Lost in NCAA 1st Rd
2006-2007 Syracuse 24 11 Lost in NIT Quarter-Finals
2007-2008 Syracuse 21 14 Lost in NIT Quarter-Finals
2008-2009 Syracuse 12 1
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 9:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
With the notable exception of the championship...
…color me unimpressed.
And again, he had the benefit of not having to take over a team that went 11-18 a year prior.
Context!
by BBallSophist on Dec 30, 2008 10:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That is debatable, I'll give you that.
I think it’s a wash, but it’s debatable. And other statistics could be factored into the equation. Boeheim has been bad since he won the championship (they look good this year, though).
But Pearl and Few? No way. (-:
Again, context is important. These statistics are fine, but statistics without analysis or context is not enough. Kentucky is going to have a much easier go of it in the SEC than UCONN in the Big East this year and could easily end up with a better overall record than UCONN, but I don’t think that necessarily means UK is better than UCONN. Mark Few gets the benefit of playing in the West Coast Conference every year, which is slightly less rigorous than the Big East.
In 1 out of your 2 benchmarks, Pitino is better than Few:
Few: 5-7 in NCAA Games
Pitino: 9-3 in NCAA Games
I’m sure Few has a better w-l record, and I don’t feel like looking it up, haha. They haven’t played each other head-to-head. Tie goes to Pitino, who has reached the FF and elite 8 in the 2Ks and plays in a much tougher conference (even when in C-USA).
In 2 out 3 of your benchmarks, Pitino is better than Pearl:
Pearl 7-5 in NCAA Games
Pitino 9-5 in NCAA Games
Pitino 1-0 against Pearl.
Overall records from 2001-02 season to last year (Pitino’s first year):
Pitino: 169-67 – 71.6% win percentage, 7 more wins, 5 more losses
Pearl: 162-62 – 72.3% win percentage.
So, by using your 3 benchmarks, Pitino has been better than Pearl in the 2Ks. Even in the one he wins, he just barely wins. Plus…PEARL SAYS HE’S BETTER! Haha (-:
by BBallSophist on Dec 30, 2008 10:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Oops...
Messed up Pitino’s NCAA record the first time. Got it right the second. 9-5 it is…still much much better than Few’s.
by BBallSophist on Dec 30, 2008 10:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Pearl
You missed some NCAA games. He coached and won many Div II NCAA games (mostly in 90’s but early 2K’s also).
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 10:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I factored in all of his NCAA wins from 01-02 season on.
Pitino wasn’t at Louisville (or any other college, div II or otherwise) in the 2Ks until the 01-02 season. I’m not counting any of Pearl’s or Few’s data before that because you can’t compare Pitino’s numbers if he wasn’t coaching in college in 00-01.
In 01-02 Milwaukee was 15-13. Didn’t go to NCAA. 02-03 they were 0-1, lost to ND in first round. 03-04 they went to NIT. 04-05 they were 2-1, lost to #1 seed Illinois…then he went to Tennessee where he went 1-1, 2-1, 2-1, respectively.
7-5 since 2001-02 season. Pitino is 9-5 since 2001-02 season. Just for fun, I tried looking up how many Div. II NCAA wins Pearl had in 2000, but I can’t find that info for the life of me…
And anyways, Div II…really? Gimme a break. Let’s at least stick to Division 1. You’re really reaching. Hell, if we’re gonna factor that in, let’s put Pearl as one of the top 10 college basketball coaches of the 90’s. I’m sure a lot of other Div II coaches would have something to say about being considered “elite” as well.
Admit it: according to your benchmarks, Pitino MUST be better than Pearl in the 2Ks. Also Pitino has a FF and an Elite 8 in the 2Ks. Pearl only has a couple of sweet sixteens as his best effort.
Still, Pearl may surpass him soon. We’ll see…but Pitino has been better so far.
by BBallSophist on Dec 30, 2008 11:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I Counted All Of The 2K's
Pearl has a much better W-L record.
He’s a better coach (now) than Pitino (now).
Pitino was a better coach (then) than Pearl (then).
Most remember Pitino then. I look at him now.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 31, 2008 8:09 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That's ridiculous.
Who is saying anything about “then”? I’ve been using all available data from the “2K’s”. And, honestly, we’re in 2008 now. We’re a long ways away from 2000. One could easily argue that “now” should be defined as something like the last 5 years instead of the last 8 years.
You cannot factor in a full season when Pitino wasn’t even coaching in college. You can’t compare Pitino’s 2K performance and just chalk up 2000-01 season as 0-0 in your stats. Nor can you compare Division II records to Division I. Just totally absurd. Like I said, if we’re going to factor in Div II records, this whole coaches debate needs to be expanded upon 10-fold. I don’t follow Div II, but I bet there are some wildly successful coaches there right now who would love to have their overall records in the 2K’s compared to the elite coaches in Div I. Our list would be much different, I would guess.
PLUS, Pitino STILL beats him in 2 out of 3 of your benchmarks. All you did was re-state something I already admitted: that Pearl had a better W/L record in the 2K’s, and that when you factor in his record at USI, it’s “much” better.
You have no argument and are incapable of admitting that even when you set the parameters of the debate within a rigid set of numbers with no context, you’re still wrong, and you look silly for it.
Pearl VEHEMENTLY disagrees with your assertion. So would any rational person. Your bias bleeds through your statistics. I don’t even like Pitino, and I like Pearl, but no one, including Pearl himself, can honestly argue that Pearl is better than Pitino right now. Pitino beat the crap out of Pearl last year, and the talent differential was minimal (also asserted by Pearl).
No doubt you’ll just copy and paste your same argument from above without any acknowledgment of any of my points.
by BBallSophist on Dec 31, 2008 8:54 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He wont reply
DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!
by davw83 on Dec 31, 2008 9:06 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I Will
I counted any coach’s record throughout the 2K’s.
Pearl has a better record than Pitino in that timeframe.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 31, 2008 9:40 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Frustrating
All your doing is endlessley repeating yourself. I think Sophist makes a valid argument about the amount of time Pitino has actually coached basketball in the 2000’s and the fact that you shouldnt compare Pearl’s D2 record. You havent responded to that at all. You arent having a conversation or recognizing other’s points of view at all. I get you think your right but at least try and explain WHY you use the argument that you do instead of repeating it over and over. Somtimes posting with you is like posting with a brick wall. You dont listen man.
DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!
by davw83 on Dec 31, 2008 9:56 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I Stated 2K's (Not 2002 Thru 2008)
Pitino was 0-0 in 1998 and 99. Tubby was 63-13. Is he THAT much better?
Pitino was 0-0 in 2000 and 01. Tubby was 47-20. Ditto?
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 31, 2008 11:03 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm totally confused now...
We switched from Pearl and Pitino to Pitino and Tubby, and I think you’re making my point for me, but I’m not sure. What you just said points out how shaky these statistics can be when used in a vacuum without context or when unadjusted. I’m playing your game, beating you at it, and showing how silly it all is in the process. And still Pitino wins vs. Pearl in 2 out of 3 of your benchmarks in the 2K’s.
Your arguments are stuck in black and white world. I choose to argue in a world with not only shades of gray, but color as well.
I still like you, though (-: Just like I like Bruce Pearl, haha.
by BBallSophist on Dec 31, 2008 2:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Examples
I said all of the decades. It’s bone simple.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 31, 2008 2:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Florida Was A Cupcake For Most Of The 1990's
Vandy not much better then. Except for Arkansas, SEC was mostly cupcakes in early to mid 1990’s.
Pitino > Tubby in 90’s. But Tubby > Pitino now.
Hatred like yours can only mean one thing.
Thankfully, it’s not many.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 31, 2008 2:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
And just what exactly is that "one thing"?
Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."
by chirop1 on Dec 31, 2008 2:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
??????
??
Super confused now. No idea where “hate” came from.
by BBallSophist on Dec 31, 2008 2:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I feel dumber...
…having read this string, although BBallSophist wins the debate hands down.
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Dec 31, 2008 5:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Hmmm.
Forty, tread carefully here. We have had this conversation before.
A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan
by Truzenzuzex on Dec 31, 2008 6:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I Just Simply Compared Results By Decade
Not by specific years within a decade.
I said that from the start.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 31, 2008 8:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You just admitted to liking Pearl
Now I must ask Tru to revoke your posting privileges.
Sorry, I’ve enjoyed having you around… but those are the rules.
;-)
Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."
by chirop1 on Dec 31, 2008 9:07 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I do ...
… loathe Pearl.
But others are permitted to like him, even if it does make me throw up in my mouth a little. :-)
A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan
by Truzenzuzex on Dec 31, 2008 9:10 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Haha.
He’s a funny guy. Kind of annoying, but funny! I like funny guys.
by BBallSophist on Dec 31, 2008 2:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I Don't Like Him At All
But he has an impressive coaching record.
He’s a snake. Never more so than the Deon Thomas incident back in 1989 involving Illinois and Iowa recruiting.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 31, 2008 9:41 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Pearle was right...
…regarding the Thomas incident. College basketball would be better if other coaches self-policed and reported incidents. I think he showed courage.
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Dec 31, 2008 5:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
For the record ...
… I have no idea whether he was right or not, but his tactics may have been violations of state and federal law. It was certainly an ethical faux pas.
It doesn’t take courage to do what Pearl did, only anger and determination. Apparently, the NCAA did not agree with him. Thomas denied Pearl’s allegations and passed a lie detector on the subject. None of this is dispositive in any way to either side, but secretly recording a conversation with a recruit without his knowledge or intent and trying to get him to admit a violation is unethical.
A Sea of Blue -- Kentucky Sports for the Discerning Fan
by Truzenzuzex on Dec 31, 2008 6:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Pearle = Whistleblower
It does take courage to be a whistleblower….I can give you a multitude of examples. One of the risks is having ones career destroyed which in this case nearly happened.
So you say Thomas passed a lie detector test? Yes. I say Illinois was indeed determined to be cheating and was penalized accordingly.
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Jan 1, 2009 11:20 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Pearl
Was hardly a whistleblower.
He was cheating FOR Iowa.
Illinois was found innocent in the Deon Thomas case.
by FortyYearCatFan on Jan 1, 2009 12:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Not EVEN Close
Pearl CHEATED and then tried to make it look like Illinois did.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 31, 2008 8:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
2K's = 2000 Thru 2008 So Far
1990’s = 1990 thru 1999.
Those are the decades of comparison.
For EXAMPLE, Pitino coached 1990-97 and Tubby 1992-99. 8 years each in 90’s. Pitino > Tubby in 1990’s.
Tubby coached 2000-08 in 2K’s. Pitino 2002-08. Tubby > Pitino in 2K’s.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 31, 2008 9:44 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Clarifications
The basketball season takes place over two calendar years. So when talking about decades (10 years), you have to settle on whether or not the ‘99-’00 season is where the 2K’s start or whether ‘00-’01 season is where it starts. You switch back and forth in how you define it, usually depending on whichever one helps your argument the most. You need to be more specific when citing a season i.e. ‘01-02’ versus ‘2001’.
Otherwise you’re claiming a decade is 11 years.
Alright, that’s my last word. You get the last one if you want, Forty (-:
by BBallSophist on Dec 31, 2008 2:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes
Whatever a coach did during the decade.
It’s VERY simple.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 31, 2008 2:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
LOL...
…easy call FYCF couldn’t keep from getting in the last word.
Reminds me of my two teenage sons….hey, and they argue by bringing up the same point over and over and over again, too, while not listening to others.
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Dec 31, 2008 5:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If you are going by the distant past
I suppose we should place Bob Knight, John Wooden and Dean Smith abobe Pitino in the elite level as well. None have done anything in the past ten years, but look at what they did in the past.
FYCF is abosolutely correct. If you want to judge who is elite, you must look at what they have done in the recent past. Ten years ago is distant history as the kids that play now do not know about those days.
by wklawdog on Dec 30, 2008 9:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No Doubt
Roy Williams, Billy Donovan, Bill Self, Jim Calhoun (et al) are the hot coaches right now. Ben Howland, too.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 10:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Patrick Patterson :-)
I was just checking the stats and Patterson has made 16 in a row from the free throw line. That’s great… Hopefully I didn’t jinx him with this post….
As a team, the Cats are shooting 77.9% (basically 78%) from the free throw line. I hope we can keep it up.
by OGETARTS on Dec 30, 2008 1:00 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
PP
is fabulous. I think he is around for one more year. He is not going to be a lottery pick as foreign players are loading up this years lottery… but next year he could certainly be one.
by MyBloodRunsBlue on Dec 30, 2008 1:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
PP Underrated As HS Junior (Not Even Top 50)
UK was first major school to seriously recruit him prior to summer 2006 AAU events.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 1:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Playing in OJ Mayo's shadow will do that to you I guess.
Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."
by chirop1 on Dec 30, 2008 1:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
But He Didn't
Mayo played at North College Hill HS in Cincy in 2004-05-06. He only played with Patterson as senior in 2007.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 1:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Oklahoma @ Arkansas tonight
The Sooners are due for a loss. I think this could be a very interesting game. Arkansas will have the home court advantage and they are playing pretty well.
Fortson vs Warren (two players UK recruited) will be a really fun battle to watch.
by OGETARTS on Dec 30, 2008 2:40 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I agree...
this is one game that makes me wish I had ESPN360.
by mrmondaynite on Dec 30, 2008 3:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Lets hear if for the Arkansas Razorpelphries!!!!
Way to show the nation that the SEC isn’t dead quite yet!!!
Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."
by chirop1 on Dec 31, 2008 7:24 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Some news coming out of Memphis from Demling...
Dicky Lyons, Jr won the Elvis Presley contest which does not surprise me one bit. Haha.
http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20081230/SPORTS03/81230030/-1/gallerystrip
by kykat51 on Dec 30, 2008 3:56 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
NBAdraft.net
Patterson # 16…no Meeks.
It’s baffling how different the mock OGETARTS provides and nbadraft are.
by mrmondaynite on Dec 30, 2008 5:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I would never draft Meeks myself...
production (ESPECIALLY offensive) doesn’t mean he’ll be a good pro.
by mrmondaynite on Dec 30, 2008 5:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
At least not based
on this season.
by mrmondaynite on Dec 30, 2008 5:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Mockdrafts
are worth absolutely nothing.
Of all the polls/lists/rankings mock drafts are the absolute least list of substance.
DEEETROIT BASKETBALLL!!!
by davw83 on Dec 30, 2008 6:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Hope Patterson stays
exactly we he is at.That means we get him for another year!But,if he is not a lock for the lottery,I feel he will return.
by -Zoso- on Dec 30, 2008 5:43 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
this is not UK news, but it is shocking...
Shanahan out in Denver….
WOW…
Steelers fan 1st! UK is my 2nd love.
by vinceuk1 on Dec 30, 2008 6:53 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
i mean, the guy won 2 Super Bowls for goodness sakes..!
Steelers fan 1st! UK is my 2nd love.
by vinceuk1 on Dec 30, 2008 6:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Changing of the guard, Vince.
Plus, Shanahan WAS the G.M. in Denver after the Broncos fired (former) G.M. Ted Sundquist. Shanahan was essentially in charge of personnel, and they’ve been drafting and hitting the free agent pool poorly.
What we have to worry about is Cowher’s return in 2010 occurring simultaneously with the end of Kevin Colbert’s contract. God knows the Rooneys aren’t going to break bank to keep him if he wants to leave to join Cowher somewhere.
by mrmondaynite on Dec 30, 2008 7:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You can say it's UK-related...
because the Broncos wisely picked up Wesley Woodyard before the season.
by mrmondaynite on Dec 30, 2008 7:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
good point abput Wesley...lol
Still, Cowher= 1 SB in 13 years at Pittsburgh
Shanahan = 2 SB’s in 14 yrs at Denver… Plus, The Broncos have had tons of injuries this year…
I just think he’s a damn good coach….
Steelers fan 1st! UK is my 2nd love.
by vinceuk1 on Dec 30, 2008 7:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I certainly agree...
but not winning the piss-poor AFC West after leading the division for 90 % of the season had something to do with it. Logically, if you say he should stay because of his tenure as an “established” coach, you have to also address how such an “established” coach could allow his team to collapse like Shanahan did this year. That said, I’m just as surprised as you that it happened.
Of course John Clayton has a column in response entitled, “Cowher Makes Sense”
Here’s a good explanation: http://sports.espn.go.com/broadband/video/videopage?videoId=3800899&categoryId=2459789
by mrmondaynite on Dec 30, 2008 7:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Anyway...go Steelers in a week and a half, sir!
by mrmondaynite on Dec 30, 2008 7:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yes sir..!
i just seen a scroll on ESPN that said, “Jets & Cowher have mutual interest”
Steelers fan 1st! UK is my 2nd love.
by vinceuk1 on Dec 30, 2008 7:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think this link address that fairly well...
http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/12/30/schefter-cowher-wont-coach-in-2009/
It basically indicates just what the ESPN scroll noted – it’s just “interest.”
by mrmondaynite on Dec 30, 2008 7:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I totally forgot about all their injuries...
you’re right on about that.
by mrmondaynite on Dec 30, 2008 7:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
BCG against UK's top 3 OOC teams...
He also points out that against UK’s big three non-conference rivals, Gillispie is 1-4.
Traitor Rick was 1-5 against those same rivals his first two years and he did ok…
Just pointing that out…
Steelers fan 1st! UK is my 2nd love.
by vinceuk1 on Dec 30, 2008 7:02 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Those were the probation years right?
Slower Traffic Keep Right!
by SevenRings on Dec 30, 2008 7:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
those were "rebuilding" years, just like BCG fell into
Steelers fan 1st! UK is my 2nd love.
by vinceuk1 on Dec 30, 2008 7:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, wow...
…it must have been a mis-type. You can’t be writing that BCG’s ‘challenges’ are similar to what Pitino faced, right?
'..when they bring a knife, you bring a gun...that's the Chicago way..'
by HozeKing on Dec 30, 2008 8:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Of course they are...
Maybe not quite as difficult, but challenges none the less…
plus, I was just pointing out, that if you are going to call out BCG for a 1-4 mark against “like” teams, then it’s only fair to point out Traitor Ricks 1-5 records against those same teams, in the same time frame of their coaching career at UK…
but thanx for your smugness hoze…
Steelers fan 1st! UK is my 2nd love.
by vinceuk1 on Dec 30, 2008 8:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Pitino Never Beat UNC Or Duke, Beat Kansas Once
0-3 vs. UNC in 1990, 91, 95. 0-1 vs. Duke in 92. 1-1 vs. Kansas in 90, 91.
UK was on NCAA Probation in 1977 and 78 yet went 56-6 (8-1 in NCAA games) those 2 years.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 8:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
But...
how many games in a row did Pitino lose to Florida or Vandy??? Comparing Tubby to Pitino is like comparing a Caddy to a Ferrari, both good cars, but the caddy is out of its league…
by MyBloodRunsBlue on Dec 31, 2008 2:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It's early, BUT......
Arkansas is leading Oklahoma, 16-8.
by OGETARTS on Dec 30, 2008 8:23 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Also - Alex Legion with 6 pts on 3/6 shooting in 13 minutes for Illinois (7 minutes left in game)
by blbskue on Dec 30, 2008 8:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Legion Getting Better Each Game
He’ll do well there for Bruce Weber.
He’d be watching Jodie Meeks at UK.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 8:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree - the transfer was probably best for all parties.
Especially considering the drama.
by blbskue on Dec 30, 2008 8:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yup... Pel had them ready to play
Ark is up 47-31.
by OGETARTS on Dec 30, 2008 9:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Refs just bailed out Purdue...lol
they are playing OT now…
Steelers fan 1st! UK is my 2nd love.
by vinceuk1 on Dec 30, 2008 8:56 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
JJ Missed His 2nd FTA
Illinois is tough opponent.
Hope we W anyway.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 30, 2008 8:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Illinois won
Legion had 12 points and 3 rebounds. He was 1-4 from 3pt range.
by OGETARTS on Dec 30, 2008 9:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think he hit 2 3 pointers
At least I saw hit point total go from 6 to 9 to 12. . .
by blbskue on Dec 31, 2008 7:59 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He Played His Best Game At U Of IL
Tough L for Purdue.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 31, 2008 8:06 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
All I saw was the ill-advised 3 pointer early in the shot clock
With less than a minute to play in OT that gave Purdue a chance to close to within one after he missed it.
Of course its difficult, its a shortcut... if it was easy it'd just be "the way."
by chirop1 on Dec 31, 2008 8:10 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He was NOT 1-4 from 3pt range
He was actually 1-5 per the “official” box score at Purdue’s web site:. ;-)
His official stats were:
12 points (1-5 from 3pt range)
5 rebounds
1 assist
0 turnovers
by OGETARTS on Dec 31, 2008 8:20 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I Think He'll Do Well There
Illini assistant Jerrance Howard (briefly at UK) is doing VERY well recruiting for the Illini.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 31, 2008 8:31 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I posted this on Saturday
"I’m watching Arkansas/NW State and
Courtney Fortson is very very good, and very fun to watch. From a 12 minute gander, he may be one of the 5 best freshmen in the SEC, if not the nation."
Arkansas looks pretty good I think. They’re sitting at 9-1 (cupcake schedule yes, but still. . .), and on pace to beat the #4 team in the country. If they can hold on coupled with UK over UofL would be a huge boost for the SEC.
by blbskue on Dec 30, 2008 9:27 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Fortson is a stud
I’ve watched him 3 times now and each time I have been really impressed with his game. He really understands the position and fits perfectly in Pel’s system.
by OGETARTS on Dec 30, 2008 9:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Fortson Was MVP At UK "Elite" Camp In Summer 2007
Too bad he didn’t make it to UK as a player.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 31, 2008 8:07 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yup, it sucks we couldn't get him
If his grades were better, I think he would have been at UK. Most people didn’t think he was going to qualify academically. I know Gillispie really liked him (a lot) as a player. We just couldn’t afford to take the chance on him with the status of Liggins still uncertain at the time.
by OGETARTS on Dec 31, 2008 8:41 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Lovely To See Pitino Lose AGAIN Tonight
He has now L to 3 teams much less talented than his team.
Must be the coaching?
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 31, 2008 8:39 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
or lack there of...
Steelers fan 1st! UK is my 2nd love.
by vinceuk1 on Dec 31, 2008 8:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No, He's Coaching Them
Just not very well right now.
They have talent.
by FortyYearCatFan on Dec 31, 2008 9:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Let's not get too happypants about this loss folks.
You know damn he will have them ready and firing against us Sunday. UL has been an up and down team thus far. I think they were very overrated preseason as #3.
Go Cats!!
by kykat51 on Dec 31, 2008 9:04 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
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